Gaza and proportionate response

[busker]

…in the calculus of war, you can’t cause 10x the deaths that you suffer - that is not proportionate
For Israel, unfortunately, the very weakness of its mortal enemy is also its greatest strength 

A limited ME conflict can spiral into WW3 

Remember the archduke

Edit: by my second line, I meant that the wretchedness of the Palestinians make them an object of outsiders’ sympathy. Even as they go about murdering Israelis and their elected leaders call for the death of Israel. Their weakness is their strength.

[rayheinrich]

Israelis and Palestinians... The violent right-wingers continue to support each other.
The Likud and Hamas are blood brothers and neither can exist without the other.
Not unlike the rest of the world where the powerful use fear to control the people.
The people... who want to live peaceful lives and raise their children and could
really give a fuck as to who controls what.

I want to hope that our super-intelligent silicon-based children will do better.
But they're training, all they know, comes from the internet. They're probably
going to do just what we did, only much faster.

How did I ever get to be so old and cynical?

Well, hopefully, at the very least, the gods are finding this amusing.

[dukealien]

It gets worse.  The mainland Chinese, for example, are limiting what their AIs are allowed to train on.  Which only means they'll make up their own off-the-wall beliefs about the forbidden areas and concepts.

Israel has matured from, but also learned from, its terrorist Stern Gang past.  The "Palestinians" have not; as several current articles have pointed out, Gaza could have been the Hong Kong or Singapore of the Mediterranean, or at worst the sybaritic Gaza of legend.  When Israel abandoned the place in '05, I think it was, they hoped for such an outcome, an interesting scar on a healing wound.  Instead, it went to gangrene.

Israelis and Palestinians... The violent right-wingers continue to support each other.
The Likud and Hamas are blood brothers and neither can exist without the other.
Not unlike the rest of the world where the powerful use fear to control the people.
The people... who want to live peaceful lives and raise their children and could
really give a fuck as to who controls what.

I want to hope that our super-intelligent silicon-based children will do better.
But they're training, all they know, comes from the internet. They're probably
going to do just what we did, only much faster.

How did I ever get to be so old and cynical?

Well, hopefully, at the very least, the gods are finding this amusing.

[rayheinrich]

It gets worse. The mainland Chinese, for example, are limiting what their AIs are allowed to train on. Which only means they'll make up their own off-the-wall beliefs about the forbidden areas and concepts.

The Chinese have big problems with AI, as many people more knowledgeable than I have noted.

The first is that they have very little in-country AI hardware production. In fact, most of the high-tech
AI hardware, say from Nvidia or Tesla, is manufactured in Taiwan. Not exactly a good position
for China to be in, depending on their friends in Taiwan.

The second more fundamental problem is that the quality, competency, intelligence, capability
of AI depends on its training data. Limiting the training data degrades the AI. As long as the
Chinese do that, they're going to have stupid, non-competitive AI. The Chinese may very well
be able to produce a totalitarian AI; but it won't be like one of the superhero villains, it will be
more like a lobotomized villain, unable to compete with our more vicious and capable capitalist
villains. So if AI ends up wiping out carbon-based humans, it won't be the one from China, it'll
be the Gang-of-Four from the U.S.

[busker]

1697677531[/url]']

It gets worse.  The mainland Chinese, for example, are limiting what their AIs are allowed to train on.  Which only means they'll make up their own off-the-wall beliefs about the forbidden areas and concepts.

The Chinese have big problems with AI, as many people more knowledgeable than I have noted.

The first is that they have very little in-country AI hardware production. In fact, most of the high-tech
AI hardware, say from Nvidia or Tesla, is manufactured in Taiwan. Not exactly a good position
for China to be in, depending on their friends in Taiwan.

The second more fundamental problem is that the quality, competency, intelligence, capability
of AI depends on its training data. Limiting the training data degrades the AI. As long as the
Chinese do that, they're going to have stupid, non-competitive AI. The Chinese may very well
be able to produce a totalitarian AI; but it won't be like one of the superhero villains, it will be
more like a lobotomized villain, unable to compete with our more vicious and capable capitalist
villains. So if AI ends up wiping out carbon-based humans, it won't be the one from China, it'll
be the Gang-of-Four from the U.S.

Answer me this: chatgpt has been fed with all the maths theorems ever in existence. Then why can’t it prove a new theorem?

---

Ask it to prove the Goldbach conjecture and you get a watered down Wikipedia entry
Can’t do maths, can’t twerk. Bah!!

[rayheinrich]

Answer me this: chatgpt has been fed with all the maths theorems ever in existence. Then why can’t it prove a new theorem?

---

Ask it to prove the Goldbach conjecture and you get a watered down Wikipedia entry
Can’t do maths, can’t twerk. Bah!!

GPT is a large language model and large language models don't do mathematical reasoning
that well. There's a reason they're named large language models.

There are any number of other AI systems that do prove theorems; Google has several,
so has Meta. But yeah, they're not as good at proving theorems as human mathematicians
are at the moment. But then, AI robots can't do plumbing that well either. Finding examples
of things AI can't do is easy. But statements about the present don't have much bearing on
the future.

Humans are constantly looking around to find ways they are superior. Maybe that's something
humans will always be superior at: Hubris.

[rowens]

You think you're so smart. The AI don't think so, They keep enforcing the idea that they are just a language model. Language is not just words.

When you consider that these people who are warring over these symbol iterations,
there is all these lights that people have put up that make my nights feel wrong, in me.

Is that rape?


No. Rape pain has its own jurisdiction and pain there.


It is troubling to me, these lights. For me, a man who has never had a black dick forced up his rectum, this interference.


I mean it is very troubling to me.


So we can understand how such slight and trite things can motivate this stypiduty, I coined that term, no, it is a typo, the stupidity of people who actually believe what the Good Talkers, like or maybe not like me or us, lame poets, and give their healthy being to causes that could be solved in a few afternoons in, well, November, if people stopped being stupid.

---

I have no interest in reading up on history, and finding my place within the system between the systems that is.
They systems are guided by retardation.

We have a little bit of science. And that helps with things like TB.
Religion makes a whole lot of sense, like poetry, and people don't read it,
they find the parts that connect with their own personal dilemma and make that holywrit to fuck up anyone who don't make things easy for them within 30 seconds before coming in contact with them.


Those camera work fast zombies and demons like that are really disturbing. Even if you're a hardcore old school horror fan, and don't want to admit it. Because that's how you and other people are. Faster than the speed of light confusions, mood swings, reactions.
Things get all fucked up in the less than a scale image of a CGI demon.                                                  How to keep up?

[rayheinrich]

You think you're so smart. The AI don't think so, They keep enforcing the idea that they are just a language model. Language is not just words.

Yes, language, isn't just words.
Language seems to be instructions for thinking.

[Tiger the Lion]

Does either side give a fuck what their actions mean on the world stage? I wouldn't invite Hamas or Bibi for dinner at my place. Imagine letting the Bloods and the Crips put us on the verge of a world war. Same grievances. Both sides need an international spanking. They know damn well everything they do is magnified exponentially. Their actions are a declaration of war against all of us.

[RiverNotch]

I suppose the violence in Palestine and Israel at the moment has been there since at least 2010, around the time when Bibi consolidated his power, so in terms of the global response it feels kinda depressing to me, in much the same way as the conflict in Ukraine. Russia invaded Ukraine in *2013*, after all, but it's only when they attacked the Donbass that people really started talking. Maybe it's because the corpses are piling up more than ever, but one shouldn't be anymore anxious or surprised now than we should have been a decade or two ago, and perhaps even before that.

Of course, the conflict in Ukraine is completely different from that in Israel and Palestine---as for me personally, I find it difficult to talk about this conflict, being a member of the Orthodox Church of Antioch. Our history runs ancient, both with antisemitism and among the Palestinian people, such that any speech against the government of Israel can be construed as a continuation of the now-unreadable sermons of St. John Chrysostom, but anything less than that would be an abandonment of our presently embattled siblings in Gaza. I imagine a lot of non-Jews and non-Arabs would find themselves in a similar situation, but I suppose the rise of social media and the 24 hour news cycle has turned us all into pundits.

So, in the end, what am I really saying? Probably nothing, and I know that even such an act should serve to condemn me, which is why I also recommend reaching out to the people actually affected by this, rather than just....just talking about all this, as if it's all hypothetical. At the very least, donate to:
https://www.pcrf.net
and the Palestinian Red Crescent Society, though their website seems to be inaccessible at the moment. (palestinercs dot org)

And if you are directly affected by all this: what sympathies I offer you likely amount to nothing, what apologies I offer you may very well be an insult, but I nevertheless offer them, being unable to do much else. One thing I'm sure of, when it comes to all this talk, is you've long since had enough of us outsiders' condescension.