The Red Valley

[IgorSShute]

Hello to everyone in the forum. This is officially the first poem I post here and it was written a few days ago. My biggest problem, or so I think, is forced rhyme. I try to remove it once I actually notice that it is pretty bad so do tell if you find one. The story is set in medieval times in a world that I am creating myself and basically most of the poems I've written or will write are set in the same world. Another problem I have is that I use a lot of pronouns (I
a problem all novice writers face, or so I hope), what I think might help is eliminating at least one word from each line, usually the first one, and they might help, I will need thoughts on that. Well, enjoy. 

1st revision:

The birds sit quiet, all humble trees are calm
No wind that howls, no sword in sturdy palm.
The shallow grass beneath the starry sky
It sleeps tonight with none to ponder why.

They rested whole and all prepared for war
That mighty hosts with early dawn had borne.
So heard afar the birds the steps of men,
And leafless trees to axes fell again,
Like long before by men to evil sworn

And once Darían’s host had come ashore
Towards the Myrēdin set in valley’s core
Were forced to march with pace to dreadful song
That sang their shaky spears, the winged and long
That clashed with foes and caused an awful roar.

And wooden bows sent arrows high to soar,
And guiltless blood in valley spilled and poured,
And ended costly march in valley thronged (?)
And left a hill of men, all simple, wronged,
And all the while the kings were left to snore.

Thus fairest valley turned to bloody sea
And common men were forced to pay the fee
And all the proudest mothers’ sonless stayed
And loving fathers’ felt an icy blade,
At least the kings had still their crown on knee.

Notes:
1. Darían is a name of a ruling house.
2. Myrēdin means 'Host of Myre', a two syllable word where ē is silent and Myre is pronounced like Mere but with a short e sound in the middle.
3. I'm not sure if thronged works in that situation, I'll need someone with a deeper knowledge to clarify. 

Original:

The birds sit quiet, all trees are calm
No wind to howl, no sword in palm
The shallow grass, the pale sky
They sleep tonight, no wonder why.

They rested whole, prepared for war
That mighty hosts at dawn did bore.
And heard afar the birds a stomp
And trees and grass to fear a chomp
By feet of those whose swords had swore.

And so the hosts had come ashore
They moved within the valley’s core
And all about they seemed to clump
But shaky spears hoped to trump
The side that ready was to roar.

And arrows started high to soar
And blood in valley spilled and poured
Two hosts that marched must now be lumped
Though sense the fear in army’s rump
And all the while the Kings did snore.

Thus valley turned to bloody sea
And painful though that it may be
That proudest mothers’ sonless stayed
And fathers’ felt an icy blade,
At least the Kings had crown on knee.

[Leanne]

Hi Igor, and welcome.  You've identified your biggest flaw but really haven't addressed it -- forced rhyme occurs when you are shoving the words into an unnatural pattern and allowing the rhyme to take control of your poem.  This can be quite clearly seen throughout your poem, with inverted syntax and missing articles/pronouns.  Most of this would be very easily fixed by allowing your lines to be longer -- pentameter instead of tetrameter, for example.  

I've just reworked your first stanza with that in mind:

The birds sit quiet, all the trees are calm,
and no man holds a sword within his palm;
upon the grass, beneath the silver sky
all sleep in peace and never wonder why.

Now, why do you change from four lines in your first stanza to five in all the others?  I suspect you have no reason, it just happened by accident.  By the time you're posting here in serious critique, you should have an answer for every choice you've made, even if it's just "I thought it might work but it hasn't".  

For such a serious subject, words like "stomp" and "rump" are pretty juvenile.  Your language must do justice to your subject -- this is just not negotiable.  Your poem at the moment reads like a bad combination of Jabberwocky and every simple war poem I've ever read.  Please address your fundamental flaws before I spend any more time on this.

[IgorSShute]

Thank you Leanne, I am working on the problems but still needed some help, that is why I post it here to hear the opinion from more experienced writers. The first stanza I hoped would be a shorter one and not really tire the reader, but the rest were longer so they do just that, make them concentrate more and even exhaust a bit (they are still too short to do something like that but I liked the idea). To be honest, the only excuse I have for using tetrameter is that it is just a habit. Now about rump and stomp and I'm sure many other words in my poems, I can try to blame the fact that English is actually not my native language and I really don't know the position that each of the words hold within the language. All I know from English is from films, TV shows and of course books. I'm still learning it and I am getting better so hopefully soon I will not have such small mistakes. Thank you for your help.

[Achebe]

Thank you Leanne, I am working on the problems but still needed some help, that is why I post it here to hear the opinion from more experienced writers. The first stanza I hoped would be a shorter one and not really tire the reader, but the rest were longer so they do just that, make them concentrate more and even exhaust a bit (they are still too short to do something like that but I liked the idea). To be honest, the only excuse I have for using tetrameter is that it is just a habit. Now about rump and stomp and I'm sure many other words in my poems, I can try to blame the fact that English is actually not my native language and I really don't know the position that each of the words hold within the language. All I know from English is from films, TV shows and of course books. I'm still learning it and I am getting better so hopefully soon I will not have such small mistakes. Thank you for your help.

Trying to learn a language better by writing in it is a pretty cool idea. I tried the same with Spanish, but it was nowhere near as good as your English, so I couldn't put my plan into practice. It might help, however, if you start with short poems rather than a medieval cycle.

[tectak]

I, myself, is still a novice at poetry and can't really give any critics.
But I like your poem and I find it poetic.

You are doing yourself, and others, no favours by this seemingly contrived non-crit. Please contact me by PM if you are seriously interested in compliance. Your choice...tectak(mod)

[IgorSShute]

1st revision:

The birds sit quiet, all humble trees are calm
No wind that howls, no sword in sturdy palm.[/size]
The shallow grass beneath the starry sky
It sleeps tonight with none to ponder why.

They rested whole and all prepared for war
That mighty hosts with early dawn had borne.
So heard afar the birds the steps of men,
And leafless trees to axes fell again,
Like long before by men to evil sworn

And once Darían’s host had come ashore
Towards the Myrēdin set in valley’s core
Were forced to march with pace to dreadful song
That sang their shaky spears, the winged and long
That clashed with foes and caused an awful roar.

And wooden bows sent arrows high to soar,
And guiltless blood in valley spilled and poured,
And ended costly march in valley thronged (?)
And left a hill of men, all simple, wronged,
And all the while the kings were left to snore.

Thus fairest valley turned to bloody seal
And common men were forced to pay the feel
And all the proudest mothers’ sonless stayed
And loving fathers’ felt an icy blade,
At least the kings had still their crown on knee.

Notes:
1. Darían is a name of a ruling house.
2. Myrēdin means 'Host of Myre', a two syllable word where ē is silent and Myre is pronounced like Mere but with a short e sound in the middle.
3. I'm not sure if thronged works in that situation, I'll need someone with a deeper knowledge to clarify. 

[tectak]

1st revision:

The birds sit quiet, all humble trees are calm
No wind that howls, no sword in sturdy palm.[/size]
The shallow grass beneath the starry sky
It sleeps tonight with none to ponder why.

They rested whole and all prepared for war
That mighty hosts with early dawn had borne.
So heard afar the birds the steps of men,
And leafless trees to axes fell again,
Like long before by men to evil sworn

And once Darían’s host had come ashore
Towards the Myrēdin set in valley’s core
Were forced to march with pace to dreadful song
That sang their shaky spears, the winged and long
That clashed with foes and caused an awful roar.

And wooden bows sent arrows high to soar,
And guiltless blood in valley spilled and poured,
And ended costly march in valley thronged (?)
And left a hill of men, all simple, wronged,
And all the while the kings were left to snore.

Thus fairest valley turned to bloody seal
And common men were forced to pay the feel
And all the proudest mothers’ sonless stayed
And loving fathers’ felt an icy blade,
At least the kings had still their crown on knee.

Notes:
1. Darían is a name of a ruling house.
2. Myrēdin means 'Host of Myre', a two syllable word where ē is silent and Myre is pronounced like Mere but with a short e sound in the middle.
3. I'm not sure if thronged works in that situation, I'll need someone with a deeper knowledge to clarify. 

Hello Igor. I "sample" reduced character point to indicate that it is possible. In the edited version I have completed. It is, shall we say, fitting. Crit coming. Best. No offence intended. tectak (mod)

---

Hello to everyone in the forum. This is officially the first poem I post here and it was written a few days ago. My biggest problem, or so I think, is forced rhyme. I try to remove it once I actually notice that it is pretty bad so do tell if you find one. The story is set in medieval times in a world that I am creating myself and basically most of the poems I've written or will write are set in the same world. Another problem I have is that I use a lot of pronouns (I
a problem all novice writers face, or so I hope), what I think might help is eliminating at least one word from each line, usually the first one, and they might help, I will need thoughts on that. Well, enjoy. 
Hi Igor. This one has had some excellent crit but I want to address some issues which are probably closer to my heart than yours. See in text.
1st revision:

The birds sit quiet, all humble trees are calm If you use "sit" then the action of "sitting" is quiet. That is not what you mean. If you say "quietly" then the birds are quiet, not the sitting. So: The birds sit quietly..... Next, "all humble trees (whatever that means) are calm.." implies that trees which are NOT humble (whatever that means) are excited beyond measure. So: the humble trees are calm (whatever that means)
No wind that howls, no sword in sturdy palm. Again, there IS wind, but it does not howl? So: No howling wind. The forced rhyme will make you write nonsense. You are the poet. Change it.
The shallow grass beneath the starry sky What is "shallow grass" beneath the cliched sky? I cannot see the image so for me it is not there.
It sleeps tonight with none to ponder why. It? What is "it"? You do not say. So if there are none to ponder why mention the fact. Who would ask why whatever is sleeping, at night...er, why? This is nonsensense rhyme...and that is the point.

They rested whole and all prepared for war
That mighty hosts with early dawn had borne. These two lines are pretentious, self-indulgent gobbledygook...and I fear there is much more to come. Who are they? What is "rested whole" distinct from? Can I assume rested in pieces? What is an "early dawn" earlier than, and how on earth is such a miracle born, borne or accompanied?Again, you seem unaware that the synaptical links in your  brain do not extend to my brain. Please try to be aware of this limitation in the evolution of humanity.
So heard afar the birds the steps of men, Sytactical melt-down.Garbage structure. Utterly without meaning. Sorry.
And leafless trees to axes fell again, The capitalising of every line is now irritating beyond measure. You comma without conscience putting "and" afterwards like some kind of apology for the insertion. I am puzzled by humble, leafless trees and saddened that they are to be felled twice but, hey, no worries, they obviously just grow again. What does it all mean and why should I care?  You fail to give me your insight into the situation

Like long before by men to evil sworn ...this not I get meaning not there is. You are trying too hard to be poetic instead of writing poetry.

And once Darían’s host had come ashore I understand the "and-iness", accept your reason for the device, but say again you sacrifice sense for style. There is no doubt that the line capitalisation is adding considerable confusion to your shaking syntax and almost convoluted Yoda-speak. The poem is limping to the finish line blooded AND bowed.  I do not wish to continue in this fashion so will ditto my way to the end.
Towards the Myrēdin set in valley’s core
Were forced to march with pace to dreadful song
That sang their shaky spears, the winged and long
That clashed with foes and caused an awful roar.

And wooden bows sent arrows high to soar,
And guiltless blood in valley spilled and poured,
And ended costly march in valley thronged (?)
And left a hill of men, all simple, wronged,
And all the while the kings were left to snore.

Thus fairest valley turned to bloody sea
And common men were forced to pay the fee
And all the proudest mothers’ sonless stayed
And loving fathers’ felt an icy blade,
At least the kings had still their crown on knee.
The notes below are of no consequence in the critique. You may as well tell me that your source material was the Dead Sea scrolls...it matters not a jot. Get the structure and clarity to inform. If you feel you need to add EXPLANATORY notes, the poem has failed before it has started. By all means inform the reader on the instigation for the piece, but yes,sir we can google...we can google all night long Best, tectak
Notes:
1. Darían is a name of a ruling house....and a very common boys name in the 1990's
2. Myrēdin means 'Host of Myre', a two syllable word where ē is silent and Myre is pronounced like Mere but with a short e sound in the middle....as is Myredin. You couldn't make it up; could you?
3. I'm not sure if thronged works in that situation, I'll need someone with a deeper knowledge to clarify. 

Original:

The birds sit quiet, all trees are calm
No wind to howl, no sword in palm
The shallow grass, the pale sky
They sleep tonight, no wonder why.

They rested whole, prepared for war
That mighty hosts at dawn did bore.
And heard afar the birds a stomp
And trees and grass to fear a chomp
By feet of those whose swords had swore.

And so the hosts had come ashore
They moved within the valley’s core
And all about they seemed to clump
But shaky spears hoped to trump
The side that ready was to roar.

And arrows started high to soar
And blood in valley spilled and poured
Two hosts that marched must now be lumped
Though sense the fear in army’s rump
And all the while the Kings did snore.

Thus valley turned to bloody sea
And painful though that it may be
That proudest mothers’ sonless stayed
And fathers’ felt an icy blade,
At least the Kings had crown on knee.

[/b]

[laltieri0]

The birds sit quiet, all humble trees are calm all sounds awkward when read aloud
No wind that howls, no sword in sturdy palm.
The shallow grass beneath the starry sky
It sleeps tonight with none to ponder why.

They rested whole and all prepared for war
That mighty hosts with early dawn had borne.  this is convoluted
So heard afar the birds the steps of men, 
And leafless trees to axes fell again, good
Like long before by men to evil sworn

And once Darían’s host had come ashore
Towards the Myrēdin set in valley’s core
Were forced to march with pace to dreadful song   who were forced
That sang their shaky spears, the winged and long the winged and long _____?
That clashed with foes and caused an awful roar.  reconsider "awful roar"

And wooden bows sent arrows high to soar,
And guiltless blood in valley spilled and poured,
And ended costly march in valley thronged (?)
And left a hill of men, all simple, wronged,
And all the while the kings were left to snore.

Thus fairest valley turned to bloody sea
And common men were forced to pay the fee
And all the proudest mothers’ sonless stayed
And loving fathers’ felt an icy blade,     remove apostrophe
At least the kings had still their crown on knee.

[Caleb Murdock]

I am hoping upon hope that you are a fairly new poet because there is a lot of talent in here, and you have tremendous room to grow and refine your writing.  I love that you are writing in rhyme and meter, both of which seem to be dying arts.

I suggest that you try writing in full sentences with proper punctuation.  I also think that you should have only one rhyme per stanza.  Two rhymes are very hard to achieve while keeping the language natural -- rhymes can take over a poem.  And don't be afraid of off-rhymes or internal rhymes.  Also, writing about a fantasy world will limit your appeal to whatever audience you have -- is it really so hard to write about real life?  You also have some cliched images (humble, calm trees; starry sky, etc.).

Here is your first stanza:

The birds sit quiet, all humble trees are calm
No wind that howls, no sword in sturdy palm.
The shallow grass beneath the starry sky
It sleeps tonight with none to ponder why.

Here it is rewritten in sentences. Doesn't it sound a little better?

The birds sit quietly; all humble trees are calm.
No wind howls, no sword in sturdy palm.
The shallow grass beneath the starry sky
Sleeps tonight with none to ponder why.

"No sword in sturdy palm" is still a fragment, but it works. All I did was to remove two words, change "quiet" to "quietly", and make adjustments to the punctuation.  Properly written sentences are always clearer than fragments.