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2nd Attempt:
Shoot the breeze all ‘round logic trees from lost forests just begotten.
Root square and cube stored in vacuum tube computed then forgotten.
Phrase a query? Read the Doctrine? Resolution part of the Question.
Subscribe to theory. Heed the Caution. Explanation heart of Confusion.
Musings of an Aristotle trapped on the Great X Unknown ~
mere mystery in a genie's bottle capped by the Philosopher's Stone.
Saint Malthus? Quite obtuse! His population gripped upon that pin
and those angels seem of little use with their wings clipped therein.
Dissect the right angle. Then rewrite the World's creation.
Big Bang. Contract. Entangle. Free. Whose optimal iteration?
Of chessman moved by puppeteer's string easily enough,
ventriloquists own the only ears making out the bluff.
For Artificial Strife from Artificial Elixir of Artificial Life ~
spinster Midwife, the sole fixer, wields Controversial Knife.
Oh. Pundits advocate their brand-new, just found "ism".
Our poets alliterate through a purportedly profound prism.
These journeys, Clock Hands calibrate. Infinitesimal eternal moments.
Naught but finger-painted Word-Portrait. Scant internal kernel of sense.
Shoot the breeze all ‘round logic trees from lost forests just begotten.
Root square and cube stored in vacuum tube computed then forgotten.
Original:
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten.
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten.
Mystery in a genie's bottle capped by the Philosopher's Stone.
Musings of an Aristotle trapped on the great X unknown.
Search for the right angle. Next spin the Earth's revolution.
Big Bang. Contract. Entangle. Free. Iterate optimal solution?
Saint Malthus. Most obtuse. His wings clipped therein.
Those angels. Little use. Population gripped upon that pin.
Artificial Elixir of Artificial Life enduring Artificial Strife.
The sole fixer, spinster Midwife wielding Controversial Knife.
Chessman moved by puppeteer's string easily enough.
Ventriloquists own the only ears making out the bluff.
Pundits advocate their brand-new, just found "ism".
Poets alliterate through a purportedly profound prism.
Journeys, Clock Hands calibrate. Infinitesimal eternal moments.
A finger-painted Word-Portrait. Scant internal kernel of sense.
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten.
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten.
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 I wish I did, but I don't have a clue what's going on here. Could be you, could be me.
"trees of logic not quite begotten." stopped me but I figured I might get through it when I could follow and liked L2. Then alchemy, ok, what about it? L4-6:I got nothing. Google St Malthus, ok, population, still lost. L9-12  L13/14 ok, I get that and nicely phrased. After that nothing. Sorry, we have some members that may very well do better with this, welcome to the pen and thanks for the critiques you've already given others, glad to have you here. 
Oh, and I like the title, it helps, just not enough for me.
billy wrote:welcome to the site. make it your own, wear it like a well loved slipper and wear it out. ella pleads:please click forum titles for posting guidelines, important threads. New poet? Try Poetic DevicesandWard's Tips
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(05-04-2017, 10:21 PM)ellajam Wrote: I wish I did, but I don't have a clue what's going on here. Could be you, could be me.
"trees of logic not quite begotten." stopped me but I figured I might get through it when I could follow and liked L2. Then alchemy, ok, what about it? L4-6:I got nothing. Google St Malthus, ok, population, still lost. L9-12 L13/14 ok, I get that and nicely phrased. After that nothing. Sorry, we have some members that may very well do better with this, welcome to the pen and thanks for the critiques you've already given others, glad to have you here.
Oh, and I like the title, it helps, just not enough for me.
Yeah. I was sort of worried that it would be kind of vague. Was going for imagery that more or less linked together in my mind but probably not to others.
Here's some of what I was attempting but, naturally, if I have to explain it, my souffle flopped
Trees of logic: http://legacy.earlham.edu/~peters/course...eeprop.htm ( math / philosophy term)
Roots of cubes = cube roots, a math term ... ties into the tree image (or so I hoped!)
Vacuum Tubes = early computers ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_va..._computers
L1 & L2 were intended to mean that you can figure things out in the world but only in an elusive temporary way....
"Saint Malthus. Most obtuse. His wings clipped therein.
Those angels. Little use. Population gripped upon that pin."
was going for more imagery but guess it didn't work. Going for saying things like the "revered" Malthusian Theory of population growth (& other theories)...not useful for explaining everything ..."wings clipped" = cutting his theories down to size ...the "wing" / Saint imagery tying into angels ... tying into the philosophical question "how many angels fit on the head of a pin?" and back again to "population".
Philosopher's stone = lead in to Aristotle.
Ah well, guess I was the one being too obtuse. Maybe I listened to too much Bob Dylan thru the years. ;-)
Summary: Was going for ... no matter how you try or who you listen to, you can never figure out the big questions. Probably too ambitious on my part.
PS my next submission will be more light-hearted. promise.
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Quote:no matter how you try or who you listen to, you can never figure out the big questions.
That I got from the title, so I knew where the poem was heading but that just wasn't enough for me. Maybe I could have, or should have gotten the angels/pin line but I think a coherent sentence instead of 3 fragments on that line might have helped.
Don't give up on it, mine is just one member's read, let's see what others come up with, if they don't do any better still don't give up, edit.
PS: All types of poetry are welcome here, variety/spice yanno. 
billy wrote:welcome to the site. make it your own, wear it like a well loved slipper and wear it out. ella pleads:please click forum titles for posting guidelines, important threads. New poet? Try Poetic DevicesandWard's Tips
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[quote="ellajam" pid='227916' dateline='1493908525']
Quote: still don't give up, edit.
if so, should I bag the internal rhymes? Suppose that I'd almost have to.
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(05-04-2017, 11:53 PM)Szczepan Wrote: [quote="ellajam" pid='227916' dateline='1493908525']
Quote: still don't give up, edit.
if so, should I bag the internal rhymes? Suppose that I'd almost have to.
If you like the internal rhymes keep them. If you think the rhymes are damaging clarity or misrepresenting the content remove them.
I think that's more of a stylistic choice honestly.
The secret of poetry is cruelty.--Jon Anderson
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(05-04-2017, 11:55 PM)Todd Wrote: If you like the internal rhymes keep them. If you think the rhymes are damaging clarity or misrepresenting the content remove them.
I think that's more of a stylistic choice honestly.
OK. Makes sense. This is going to be a tough edit. If I make things too understandably cut-and-dry, it defeats the purpose.
This is going to take a few hikes, maybe a couple of long drives and some good ol' head scratchin' to strike a balance.
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(05-05-2017, 12:13 AM)Szczepan Wrote: (05-04-2017, 11:55 PM)Todd Wrote: If you like the internal rhymes keep them. If you think the rhymes are damaging clarity or misrepresenting the content remove them.
I think that's more of a stylistic choice honestly.
OK. Makes sense. This is going to be a tough edit. If I make things too understandably cut-and-dry, it defeats the purpose.
This is going to take a few hikes, maybe a couple of long drives and some good ol' head scratchin' to strike a balance.
I really don't think you should change the poem to make it more understandable. You've got a lot of metaphors and imagery that just make it enjoyable to read. Someone doesn't have to understand every word of the poem to get the idea of it. I honestly didn't see any of it over complicated.
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A poem should make sense when read out loud, otherwise you'll lose the reader.
~ I think I just quoted myself - Achebe
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Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten. If you hadn't provided the link, I would have gone elsewhere
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten. why forgotten? or, is this metaphor
Mystery in a genie's bottle capped by the Philosopher's Stone. a list poem that points to the same conclusion
Musings of an Aristotle trapped on the great X unknown. interpersonal
Search for the right angle. Next spin the Earth's revolution. please tell me this is balm and not another reaching for offense...
Big Bang. Contract. Entangle. Free. Iterate optimal solution? ...but.be.. clear.. the solution...don't dilly-dally
Saint Malthus. Most obtuse. His wings clipped therein. like the carrier pigeon
Those angels. Little use. Population gripped upon that pin. safety
Artificial Elixir of Artificial Life enduring Artificial Strife. yes indeed, couldn't agree more, blasted!
The sole fixer, spinster Midwife wielding Controversial Knife. again?
Chessman moved by puppeteer's string easily enough. okay, now this really made me laugh. I could see the string of
awkwardness
Ventriloquists own the only ears making out the bluff. a person holds on because there is hope for the worst of us
Pundits advocate their brand-new, just found "ism". cedar bricks work nicely in closets
Poets alliterate through a purportedly profound prism. change purportedly
Journeys, Clock Hands calibrate. Infinitesimal eternal moments. it's no one's business, the time
A finger-painted Word-Portrait. Scant internal kernel of sense. more insult, very poetic
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten. explain the roots again
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten. oh, there it is and oops there it goes again
Hi Szczepan, I had to google the saint but we won't get into THAT hahaha.
I get where you are going and it is a thought provoking poem to say the least
which proves the poet may have some ingenuity or experience in word code.
Sorry I am a grouch now and having a hard time being a helpful critique.
I do want to help, it's my heart's desire, but I fail often.
It's cloudy here, I hope your day is much nicer and you find joy
comfort and peace where you are. Best to you.
Oh, wait I hear the beautiful rain.
janine
there's always a better reason to love
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Thanks Janine,
Still digesting your comments.
one thing. Iif I change "purportedly", the "p" alliteration may go kaput :-(
This is going to take a whole lot of thinkin' and revising on my part.
& Thanks to one and all as well! Hope you guys are all better at figuring out those answers than me!! (wink, nod)
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Being as uncultured as I am, I struggle to catch on to a lot of the things that you are referring to. But looking at the poem from a purely aesthetic level, I think it is very brilliantly constructed, with some very clever internal rhymes throughout. If you intend for the wider, non academic crowd to grasp the meaning of the poem, I would advise that you make references to more famous examples of logic being used 'ie Pythagoras, newton, Einstein ect..'
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten.- After a couple of reads I finally got this. But I'm not quite sure if it makes sense... How can these trees of logic you speak of, produce a breeze if they're not yet conceived?
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten.
Mystery in a genie's bottle capped by the Philosopher's Stone.
Musings of an Aristotle trapped on the great X unknown.
Search for the right angle. Next spin the Earth's revolution.
Big Bang. Contract. Entangle. Free. Iterate optimal solution?
Saint Malthus. Most obtuse. His wings clipped therein.
Those angels. Little use. Population gripped upon that pin.
Artificial Elixir of Artificial Life enduring Artificial Strife.
The sole fixer, spinster Midwife wielding Controversial Knife.
Chessman moved by puppeteer's string easily enough.
Ventriloquists own the only ears making out the bluff.
Pundits advocate their brand-new, just found "ism".
Poets alliterate through a purportedly profound prism.
Journeys, Clock Hands calibrate. Infinitesimal eternal moments.
A finger-painted Word-Portrait. Scant internal kernel of sense.
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten.
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten.
[/quote]
Being as uncultured as I am, I struggle to catch on to a lot of the things that you are referring to. But looking at the poem from a purely aesthetic level, I think it is very brilliantly constructed, with some very clever internal rhymes throughout. If you intend for the wider, non academic crowd to grasp the meaning of the poem, I would advise that you make references to more famous examples of logic being used 'ie Pythagoras, newton, Einstein ect..'
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten.- After a couple of reads I finally got this. But I'm not quite sure if it makes sense... How can these trees of logic you speak of, produce a breeze if they're not yet conceived?
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten.
Mystery in a genie's bottle capped by the Philosopher's Stone.
Musings of an Aristotle trapped on the great X unknown.
Search for the right angle. Next spin the Earth's revolution.
Big Bang. Contract. Entangle. Free. Iterate optimal solution?
Saint Malthus. Most obtuse. His wings clipped therein.
Those angels. Little use. Population gripped upon that pin.
Artificial Elixir of Artificial Life enduring Artificial Strife.
The sole fixer, spinster Midwife wielding Controversial Knife.
Chessman moved by puppeteer's string easily enough.
Ventriloquists own the only ears making out the bluff.
Pundits advocate their brand-new, just found "ism".
Poets alliterate through a purportedly profound prism.
Journeys, Clock Hands calibrate. Infinitesimal eternal moments.
A finger-painted Word-Portrait. Scant internal kernel of sense.
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten.
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten.
[/quote]
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you are artistic with words
reading your poem i pictured frustration concerning the lack of answers, don´t know if that was your intent.
i imagine the subject turning round and round, not seeing the forest anymore because of the vast amount of trees.
of course if one is searching for a forest one can only ever find part of it in a book (21 century ruins my metaphor)
maybe i am too dumb to understand but if that poem is about the answers to the big questions, then what are the questions (or THE question) the subject wants answered?
and don´t say the question is "what is a forest" because that was only a metaphor.
maybe the lack of an exact question is the real absurdity of attempting an answer.
oh my, this reply may again be not very helpful, because i really am not educated enough to improve words or content.
still i gave you all the poem evoked in me.
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(05-10-2017, 12:27 AM)vagabond Wrote: maybe i am too dumb to understand Doubt it! maybe I'm too dumb to express myself properly. And believe me, my education is lacking in plenty of areas!
I'm still working on revisions. A couple of lines here and there are ready but still nothing to post!
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OK been thinkin' about it (and it hurts my head!)
Let's take it a coupla lines at a time....If this revision to the 1st 2 and last 2 lines, sounds like I'm more on the right track, it'll help me make further revisions:
Shoot the breeze all ‘round logic trees from ideas only just begotten.
Root square and cube stored in vacuum tube computed then forgotten.
What sayeth you all?
PS I am going for a "list poem" as Janine mentioned tho' I didn't really know it from the get go...
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(05-10-2017, 11:42 PM)Szczepan Wrote: OK been thinkin' about it (and it hurts my head!)
Let's take it a coupla lines at a time....If this revision to the 1st 2 and last 2 lines, sounds like I'm more on the right track, it'll help me make further revisions:
Shoot the breeze all ‘round logic trees from ideas only just begotten.
Root square and cube stored in vacuum tube computed then forgotten.
What sayeth you all?
PS I am going for a "list poem" as Janine mentioned tho' I didn't really know it from the get go...
I have a problem with begotten, for me it's a word used in religious texts and nowhere else, so if that's why you're using it I guess I'm just missing its relationship to logic. If you're using it for the rhyme I'd drop it. What sayeth you?
billy wrote:welcome to the site. make it your own, wear it like a well loved slipper and wear it out. ella pleads:please click forum titles for posting guidelines, important threads. New poet? Try Poetic DevicesandWard's Tips
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Sorry this shouldn't have been here.
Please go to the top for revision.
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i see the science in the piece and that part works, the problem for me lay in all the mixed metaphors. the reader is probably looking for a good key to decipher a plot, a theory, a story of sorts. at present each line is just another and sometimes mixed metaphor. there are places where a bit of filler would help. just begotten on the first line weakens it; from there some of the rhymes feel forced.
allow the reader to understand what you understand.
(05-04-2017, 09:26 PM)Szczepan Wrote: 2nd Attempt:
Shoot the breeze all ‘round logic trees from lost forests just begotten.
Root square and cube stored in vacuum tube computed then forgotten.
Phrase a query? Read the Doctrine? Resolution part of the Question.
Subscribe to theory. Heed the Caution. Explanation heart of Confusion.
Musings of an Aristotle trapped on the Great X Unknown ~ i love this line it works as a metaphor and as an image.
mere mystery in a genie's bottle capped by the Philosopher's Stone.
Saint Malthus? Quite obtuse! His population gripped upon that pin
and those angels seem of little use with their wings clipped therein.
Dissect the right angle. Then rewrite the World's creation.
Big Bang. Contract. Entangle. Free. Whose optimal iteration?
Of chessman moved by puppeteer's string easily enough,
ventriloquists own the only ears making out the bluff.
For Artificial Strife from Artificial Elixir of Artificial Life ~
spinster Midwife, the sole fixer, wields Controversial Knife.
Oh. Pundits advocate their brand-new, just found "ism".
Our poets alliterate through a purportedly profound prism.
These journeys, Clock Hands calibrate. Infinitesimal eternal moments.
Naught but finger-painted Word-Portrait. Scant internal kernel of sense.
Shoot the breeze all ‘round logic trees from lost forests just begotten.
Root square and cube stored in vacuum tube computed then forgotten.
Original:
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten.
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten.
Mystery in a genie's bottle capped by the Philosopher's Stone.
Musings of an Aristotle trapped on the great X unknown.
Search for the right angle. Next spin the Earth's revolution.
Big Bang. Contract. Entangle. Free. Iterate optimal solution?
Saint Malthus. Most obtuse. His wings clipped therein.
Those angels. Little use. Population gripped upon that pin.
Artificial Elixir of Artificial Life enduring Artificial Strife.
The sole fixer, spinster Midwife wielding Controversial Knife.
Chessman moved by puppeteer's string easily enough.
Ventriloquists own the only ears making out the bluff.
Pundits advocate their brand-new, just found "ism".
Poets alliterate through a purportedly profound prism.
Journeys, Clock Hands calibrate. Infinitesimal eternal moments.
A finger-painted Word-Portrait. Scant internal kernel of sense.
Sail the breeze all around the trees of logic not quite begotten.
Roots of cubes stored in vacuum tubes computed then forgotten.
Posts: 33
Threads: 3
Joined: May 2017
(05-12-2017, 11:15 AM)billy Wrote: allow the reader to understand what you understand.
Yeah. There's the rub. I'm going for the reader to feel what I don't understand. (& not just science).
Btw, I'm new to the concept of a "list poem" and that's what I'd like to explore here ... even as just a learning exercise.
Question .... Slightly better = "misbegotton" instead of "just begotten"? (although ideally I would like to sprinkle a little subtle religious phraseology)
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Hi Szczepan,
Let me try to tackle this one again.
I like the title.
Shoot the breeze all ‘round logic trees from lost forests just begotten.
Root square and cube stored in vacuum tube computed then forgotten.
Phrase a query? Read the Doctrine? Resolution part of the Question. -thank you, the EPA failed, a clobbering disallowed thought's
liberty.
Subscribe to theory. Heed the Caution. Explanation heart of Confusion. -maybe.
Musings of an Aristotle trapped on the Great X Unknown ~
mere mystery in a genie's bottle capped by the Philosopher's Stone.
Saint Malthus? Quite obtuse! His population gripped upon that pin -okay, now be nice. I could write an epic background tragedy.
and those angels seem of little use with their wings clipped therein. -
Dissect the right angle. Then rewrite the World's creation. -
Big Bang. Contract. Entangle. Free. Whose optimal iteration? -
Of chessman moved by puppeteer's string easily enough, -BINGO
ventriloquists own the only ears making out the bluff. -ventriloquism needs new aftershave (a fancy belt buckle would
help)
For Artificial Strife from Artificial Elixir of Artificial Life ~
spinster Midwife, the sole fixer, wields Controversial Knife. -seems this poem is on phase 3, but it's interesting info/angle
it's okay.
Oh. Pundits advocate their brand-new, just found "ism".
Our poets alliterate through a purportedly profound prism.
These journeys, Clock Hands calibrate. Infinitesimal eternal moments.
Naught but finger-painted Word-Portrait. Scant internal kernel of sense. -clever how the balance of disdain can go either way here in S2
Shoot the breeze all ‘round logic trees from lost forests just begotten.
Root square and cube stored in vacuum tube computed then forgotten.
You haven't betrayed whoever or whatever you seem to be protecting.
I skipped over upsetting lines. I hope the edginess of this write hasn't
caused any stress or sadness for you. I tried to be helpful. Ugh, I failed
again! I think you must be very very precious.
Best wishes
janine
there's always a better reason to love
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