i found this to be a really interesting read.

source:

after reading it my question is this;

is there a place for religion in the modern world.
is their a place for atheism even, or agnosticism?

i think it would be great if all religions could merge and in doing so keep the best of each. i think there is a place for religion in the modern world but on a much more personal instead of nationalistic way.


please read the source material, i found it very inciteful. especially the last few lines

I believe as much as we are physical beings we are also spiritual beings.
I believe religion will always be a part of the modern world ... as long as there are people there will be religion. There should always be a place for all types of faiths and beliefs as long as they do not cause harm to others.
I agree with you completely that it would be great if all religions could merge and in doing so keep the best of each. Sadly I doubt this will ever take place. We humans tend to be arrogant, selfish, and fearful of change. The core belief of most faiths is to love one another, to be kind, respectful, tolerant and forgiving yet with the same breath we'll scream in another's face and go as far as to maim/kill someone all in the name of God. I hold closest to Christianity because I was raised within it, but I am fascinated/curious by many faiths and systems of belief. I no longer attend church or categorize myself into any one faith and I follow no rituals but I do talk with God, give thanks, and try my best to adhere to the teachings of Jesus (as a teacher).

you said There should always be a place for all types of faiths and beliefs as long as they do not cause harm to others.

and while not knowingly having a god as such, i do believe that it's the best meme we could have.

i think it's pretty obvious from our history, that if we all forgot all our gods at the same time through some illness or disease. we'd generate new ones as soon as we recovered. i think many of us have that need.
whats worse is; we're oft more territorial about our god than we are about anything else. i wonder why that is ?

(06-07-2010, 11:38 AM)billy Wrote:  i think it's pretty obvious from our history, that if we all forgot all our gods at the same time through some illness or disease. we'd generate new ones as soon as we recovered. i think many of us have that need.
whats worse is; we're oft more territorial about our god than we are about anything else. i wonder why that is ?

Probably so, if indeed we did generate God. As to whether God is the Almighty Onipiant One (I'm refering to Jehovha/Elohim etc.) or a creation of our imagination has yet to be proven ... though I do agree that some gods have been man inspired. As for myself personaly I've had a couple of experiences that will not allow me to ignore His existence.
As for many of us having a need this is very true. Some of us are followers by nature, for some it's a need for a sense of belonging, others it's for social engagement, for some it's traditional, and for many it's personal experiences.
As to your question why we are more territorial about our God than anything else I thinks it's because we see God as the life giver of all things, He's our provider/ He saves us, heals us, cares/loves us, provides ever lasing life etc. so in return for all His goodness some of us will go to any extent to protect Him.

(06-08-2010, 06:22 AM)kath3 Wrote:  

(06-07-2010, 11:38 AM)billy Wrote:  i think it's pretty obvious from our history, that if we all forgot all our gods at the same time through some illness or disease. we'd generate new ones as soon as we recovered. i think many of us have that need.
whats worse is; we're oft more territorial about our god than we are about anything else. i wonder why that is ?

Probably so, if indeed we did generate God. As to whether God is the Almighty Onipiant One (I'm refering to Jehovha/Elohim etc.) or a creation of our imagination has yet to be proven ... though I do agree that some gods have been man inspired. As for myself personaly I've had a couple of experiences that will not allow me to ignore His existence.
As for many of us having a need this is very true. Some of us are followers by nature, for some it's a need for a sense of belonging, others it's for social engagement, for some it's traditional, and for many it's personal experiences.
As to your question why we are more territorial about our God than anything else I thinks it's because we see God as the life giver of all things, He's our provider/ He saves us, heals us, cares/loves us, provides ever lasing life etc. so in return for all His goodness some of us will go to any extent to protect Him.

i think as a race we need a god whether he's real or not.
as for the territorial thing. i agree but if we take the analogy of god being a car/ in the beginning there was only one. then all of a sudden two or three different ones. pretty soon we had lot. then we had them specially made for the masses so everyone could have one. now they're world wide many have two or more. we don't fight over who has the best car, we do often worship it. often what ever our first car is becomes the car of choice, as in "i always drive a ford" or "i'm a chevy man" why can't we be like that about our belief in god? whichever god that is or isn't.

I think most believers agree there is only one true God ... He being "Jehovah" and I'm not talking about Jehovah as in Jehovah's Witnesses, which is just another denomination. Jehovah is even named in the Koran. To date there are approx. 3,8000 denominations of Christianity so there's plenty of Fords and Chevys to choose from. What most believers argue about is not so much God but rather the denominational differences which are quite broad. I do believe in God but not as a He/She ... more as an It (energy force) that is in all things. I don't personify God as being someone sitting up in Heaven watching down from above, but if God were a He watching/looking down on all of us I think he would be utterly disgusted with our behavior.

so why can't we or those who wish to believe, believe in one religion.
why do muslims commit murder and protest so much about a cartoon or slip of the tongue and catholics mere smile, wryly

why do some religions still have holy wars. why do some religions think their Jehovah better than someone elses Jehovah?

i ask because i see no rhyme or reason why this should be so.

(06-08-2010, 06:58 AM)kath3 Wrote:  I think most believers agree there is only one true God ... He being "Jehovah" and I'm not talking about Jehovah as in Jehovah's Witnesses, which is just another denomination. Jehovah is even named in the Koran. To date there are approx. 3,8000 denominations of Christianity so there's plenty of Fords and Chevys to choose from. What most believers argue about is not so much God but rather the denominational differences which are quite broad. I do believe in God but not as a He/She ... more as an It (energy force) that is in all things. I don't personify God as being someone sitting up in Heaven watching down from above, but if God were a He watching/looking down on all of us I think he would be utterly disgusted with our behavior.

the word god is too heavy loaded,so why not just call it energy force?people fight over my god is better than yours but i can't see them fighting about my energy force is the only true one

i think thats an excellent point SJ, sad thing is, fr many having a named god whose different makes them different, better, more worthy so to speak. the mundanity of having a universal energy force looking over them wouldn't appeal.

that's the whole problem,god is so nice and cosy and personal,at least you can think of it that way,my dear god,etc.
universal energy force would be for everyone the same,so nullifying the religion idea and by the way taking away the need to fight over it and the control the people factor would be gone too

another good point. i think religion has two distinct sides to it (at least)

on the one side there's the wondrous belief that something exists the defined, even created us and everything in our universe. not something i believe in but i can see why others would and accept it as natural.

then we have those who use religion as an extortionist uses a cosh. they use it to batter it's followers into submission. they use it as a tool and weapon. i think all religions try and take control of their followers but some demand an awful lot of obedience.

(06-08-2010, 08:56 AM)billy Wrote:  so why can't we or those who wish to believe, believe in one religion.
why do muslims commit murder and protest so much about a cartoon or slip of the tongue and catholics mere smile, wryly

why do some religions still have holy wars. why do some religions think their Jehovah better than someone elses Jehovah?

i ask because i see no rhyme or reason why this should be so.

I thinks it's because there are so many different interpretations. One person or group of people will read a scripture or writing from whatever book they use and understand it differently from another person or group which is probably how we've come to have so many different denominations/religions ... birds of a feather flock together. Those with the same interpretation will now go off on their own creating a new denomination. Take baptism for example, some merely sprinkle water on the head of a new believer, while other groups practice/require total submersion ... each group will pull scriptures from the bible or whatever reference to teachings they use to back up and support their reasoning and then go to battle over whose right or wrong ... silly isn't it?

According to some statistics there are approximately 800 million Muslims world wide. If this estimation is in fact correct the Muslim population could certainly do a lot of damage to people degrading their God. From what I've read the percentage of violent Muslims is small and we all know it only takes a few rotten apples to spoil the basket. The media loves to exaggerate for ratings sake. Most Muslims are law abiding citizens wanting to live peacefully.
As for Catholics or any other religion all have their shameful histories.

I too see no rhyme or reason for all the arguing and hatred. I guess we're not as civilized as we like to think we are.

i think thats it. in fact we're far from civilized. we like to think we're civilized but all to often we'll use and abuse people by telling them what they can and cant do through priests and imams alike.

i find it so hard to understand why someone would die in the name of religion.isn't god big enough to defend himself? in truth, the concept of dying for a god scares me a little. would they kill their kids for god. bearing in mind no one has yet said Allah or Jesus told me to wear a waistcoat packed with plastik, nope, what they say is "i do it i the name of Allah or Jesus" imgine their consternation when they meet their maker and he says. "you precocious little bugger. ZAPPPPPPP"

some of their antics just befuudle my thinking. what possible reasoning do they use. i can't go with the 40 or how ever many virgins it is thing.

think about it. that means ath only virgins get into muslim heaven...what do the women get if they do indeed get there? and this for me is where allahism fails. it's way more sexist than christianity.
and i wish i'd have used this idea to create a blog

I hear you in reguards to all the silliness/foolishness of religion. It's why I want nothing to do with religion. For myself God and religion are separate ... I don't put the two together.

(06-08-2010, 03:52 PM)kath3 Wrote:  I hear you in reguards to all the silliness/foolishness of religion. It's why I want nothing to do with religion. For myself God and religion are separate ... I don't put the two together.

good idea if you have a god.

saying that, many people get solace from belonging to a religious organization and often they do do some good deeds.

being brought up in a convent, i started off believing in "the' god.
after a few months i didn't believe in anything but myself.
now i feel that the laws of the universe are god. a sort of cohesive god glue that holds and binds everything together. my spiritual belief has long since faded from whatever soul i thought i had. the three things i hold to be true is this;

people can be good, people can be bad. often people will be both.

a belief in god seldom dictates whether a person will be good or bad.
jmo.

I think we think fairly simlar. I certainly agree with your last two statements as well as your thoughts with the law of the universe being God ... I just call it "energy" an energy that if we are open to it we can commune with it. I think this is what Jesus was all about, not someone born of a virgin endowed to be the only begotten son of God or as some believe God himself.
I think he was an extrodinary man with the ability to tap into the energy of God/universe on a higher conscious level because he was open.

This is a little off topic (I won't make a habit of it) but a thought I'd like to share ... hope you don't mind? I'd be interested in your thoughts.
First I need to share that I don't "believe" in the Bible, I take it as a book containing both factual and fictional stories.
I was raised as a Christian and taught to believe that Jesus healed people. There was a story in the Bible about Jesus walking amongst a crowd and a man came up to him from behind, touched the hem of Jesus's garment and began to cry out that he had been healed. Jesus turned to the man and said ... "it is your faith that healed you" Faith (power of the mind) can have a tremendous effect on the body. I think Jesus was trying to say ... "hey, it's not me but you yourself tapping into that energy force which is available to all if we are open.