Revision

The noise of the chair falling
to the ground compresses
and fades into a single point 
in space. The headrest
rises to your hand,
and you lower yourself
to sit again. 
Smudges of mascara race
up your cheeks to settle around shining eyes.
With a fork, you remove
food from your mouth, 
and like a conductor reconstruct 
the medley of unchewed  almond-crusted salmon 
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear 
my throat so that I cannot say,

“We need to talk.”


~~
Edit: I made a lot of changes based on the comments from you all. I also decided to try out a modified version of my original (per Achebe). Every possible change is still on the table and this should be considered more of an option than a revision. I want to look at it a bit and think.


~~


Slight revisions from a NaPM thread

I remember loving this and still do. Some notes below.

(03-09-2017, 07:06 AM)Todd Wrote:  The chair rises from the floor Strong opening, I know something odd is happening here.
and you lower yourself
to sit down again, 
a ripple returning
to the pond’s surface.
While L4/5 are lovely and a strong, interesting image, for me they break up the scene, the image and sequence being built/unbuilt in the poem. If you want to use them maybe you can open with them, but ripple/pond holds a tinge of cliche.
Black smudges of mascara
race backward up your cheeks great film going in my brain
to settle around shining eyes—now dry. I think the dry is implied, if you need it maybe before eyes. I don't think you need to stress it because I've already watched the tears that streak her mascara roll back up and disappear.
With your fork, you remove 
food from your mouth, and like an artist You may not need the commas in these two lines.
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon Strong image to rewind.
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear
my throat so I cannot say,
“We need to talk.” I'm a great fan of these last lines, so painful and so impossible to rewind, better chance of unchewing salmon.

~~


Slight revisions from a NaPM thread

Hope this helps.

(03-09-2017, 07:56 AM)ellajam Wrote:  I remember loving this and still do. Some notes below.

(03-09-2017, 07:06 AM)Todd Wrote:  The chair rises from the floor Strong opening, I know something odd is happening here.
and you lower yourself
to sit down again, 
a ripple returning
to the pond’s surface.
While L4/5 are lovely and a strong, interesting image, for me they break up the scene, the image and sequence being built/unbuilt in the poem. If you want to use them maybe you can open with them, but ripple/pond holds a tinge of cliche.
Black smudges of mascara
race backward up your cheeks great film going in my brain
to settle around shining eyes—now dry. I think the dry is implied, if you need it maybe before eyes. I don't think you need to stress it because I've already watched the tears that streak her mascara roll back up and disappear.
With your fork, you remove 
food from your mouth, and like an artist You may not need the commas in these two lines.
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon Strong image to rewind.
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear
my throat so I cannot say,
“We need to talk.” I'm a great fan of these last lines, so painful and so impossible to rewind, better chance of unchewing salmon.

~~


Slight revisions from a NaPM thread

Hope this helps.

It does help thanks. I don't necessarily need the ripple but I feel I need something there to slow down the pacing otherwise it feels too fast to me--too linear. I would love to cut those commas but I keep thinking I need them from a grammar standpoint--though maybe simply shifting the sentence around will make me arrive at a more satisfying configuration. I also like the idea of cutting the dry part. Let me give it some thought.

Appreciate the critique.

Best,

Todd

(03-09-2017, 07:06 AM)Todd Wrote:  The chair rises from the floor
and you lower yourself
to sit down again,
a ripple returning
to the pond’s surface. Strong opening, rise/lower, plus again and returning evoke the title.
Black smudges of mascara
race backward up your cheeks
to settle around shining eyes—now dry. For some reason, "shining" doesn't seem to fit to me. I might just say "now dry eyes".
With your fork, you remove 
food from your mouth, and like an artist
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon 
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear
my throat so I cannot say,
“We need to talk.” Beautiful ending.

~~


Slight revisions from a NaPM thread

This is wonderful, it makes me think of myself replaying certain moments over and over again in my head, wishing I had a rewind button.

Really cool piece. The narrative is surreal and a bit confusing yet readable and inviting until the last line, where everything makes immediate sense. Some thoughts:

(03-09-2017, 07:06 AM)Todd Wrote:  The chair rises from the floor
and you lower yourself
to sit down again, 
a ripple returning
to the pond’s surface. -I actually like the placement of the metaphor here, but I feel that the metaphor itself is a little weak. Someone has mentioned that ripples in a pond feel cliche; I agree with that. Furthermore, I think that it would really enhance the piece to pick some "louder" and more jarring imagery. A ripple in a pond does not necessarily capture what it feels like to end a relationship.
Black smudges of mascara
race backward up your cheeks
to settle around shining eyes—now dry. -agree that shining should be changed. Shining eyes usually connotes with hope. Here, it seems that you want to suggest tears.
With your fork, you remove 
food from your mouth, and like an artist -why like an artist? I feel that the artist comparison is too lofty given that the image here is actually kind of disturbing; I mean, she's taking food out of her mouth (basically vomiting) and turning it back into a meal. It also feels a little thematically random; this piece is not really about art. I think there's a more appropriate comparison to be made.
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon 
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear
my throat so I cannot say, -best reversal in the piece, in my opinion (unclearing one's throat)
“We need to talk.” -I think that if you put this line in a new stanza all by itself, it would elongate the suspense, pack more into the revelation, and maybe give a brief sensation of the uncomfortable silence that usually precedes the phrase "we need to talk"

~~


Slight revisions from a NaPM thread

Really like this, overall. The piece is visually striking, and visually clean; I have no problem imagining what's happening.

Every time I came back
to read this I got teary-eyed.
It was one of those poems. Effective.
I thought I could be tough,
fight with spinning fists
create strong resistance
stand alone against an army
ward off
the climbing into my noodle
with all those twirling chopsticks,
but I was wrong. this sort
is why I came back to poetry
even if I can never write again
I can still read, fill in the spaces
of emptiness
The last line, the clincher.
you precious, beautiful, soul
that made me feel
past the fear
the pain
and this shattering.

thank you Todd

(03-09-2017, 07:06 AM)Todd Wrote:  The chair rises from the floor
and you lower yourself
to sit down again, 
a ripple returning
to the pond’s surface..... did the original have "point" somewhere?
Black smudges of mascara  ... this line feels a little clunky to me. I'd have preferred just " mascara smudges/ race etc"

race backward up your cheeks
to settle around shining eyes—now dry.
With your fork, you remove 
food from your mouth, and like an artist
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon .... the vividity! I swoon
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear...:brilliant brilliant detail in "garlic"
my throat so I cannot say,
“We need to talk.”.... phenomenal ending

~~


Slight revisions from a NaPM thread

This is close to a perfect poem. My favourite from last year's NaPM.
Sorry, can't suggest too many changes. It's glorious.

Hey Todd. It's a great piece and hard to crit near-perfection. Here goes:

(03-09-2017, 07:06 AM)Todd Wrote:  The chair rises from the floor -- makes me think of Poltergeist.
and you lower yourself
to sit down again, -- you could eliminate "down"
a ripple returning
to the pond’s surface. -- I like the "ripple....surface" bit. I've read the piece several times, and each time I need that little bit of help orienting myself in the scene because the first line is so destabilizing. I also agree with your comment about the pacing being too fast without something there. It doesn't need to be pond/ripples, per se, but something to help the reader orient in the scene is good. Your title helps with that of course, but I forget the title at the end of that first line.
Black smudges of mascara -- you could lose "black", but it's not disruptive.
race backward up your cheeks -- I'd take out "backward," it makes me think the tears should be running toward her ears like she's lying on her back. You don't need it really, the rewind theme is clear by this point.
to settle around shining eyes—now dry. -- I like "shining" because they make me think she was happy before the speaker began to speak. The "dry" issue is a bit beyond me, but I do like the sonics of 'dry, shining eyes.'
With your fork, you remove 
food from your mouth, and like an artist -- ella and you are both right about the commas. I'd punctuate thus: "...you remove food from your mouth and, like an artist, reconstruct..."  You do need commas to set off the phrase 'like an artist.' But ella is right that there's no additional subject from 'reconstruct' onward that would make a comma before 'and' necessary.
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon 
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear
my throat so I cannot say,
“We need to talk.” -- perfect ending.

~~


Slight revisions from a NaPM thread

It's a beauty, Todd. Fantastic use of imagery.

Hope this helps,

Lizzie

Damn this is a keeper Todd. The first time I read this, I wished I had written it, such a simple and clever concept that just works perfectly. Great writing Todd, some comment for consideration, Keith

(03-09-2017, 07:06 AM)Todd Wrote:  The chair rises from the floor the nature of the poem makes it hard to find a starting point, this tells us something weird is happening and when linked with the title we are dropped right in the action
and you lower yourself
to sit down again, 
a ripple returning
to the pond’s surface.the metaphor is placed perfectly but it troubled me, I wanted it to say returning to it source or something of that nature, I just don't think the ponds surface works hard enough.
Black smudges of mascara
race backward up your cheeks perfect we are totally with the N now completely clear as to what's going on
to settle around shining eyes—now dry. Shinning eyes puzzled me at first because it implies the N has feelings for her but obviously that's true because we are rewinding
With your fork, you remove 
food from your mouth, and like an artist
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon these three lines are dilghtful esp the artist ref, but I'm not sure you needed the garlic line, it just took me away from the moment and the pervious image I didn't need more detail
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear
my throat so I cannot say,
“We need to talk.” perfect ending leaves the reader with a sense of deep regret.

~~


Slight revisions from a NaPM thread

Hello everyone, I appreciate all the critiques that I've been given and I will return to the thread and address them all individually. I've been going over two poems in intensive that I want to critique and I can't think about my own writing while I'm doing that. I am thankful for the feedback though and will address it over the next day or two.

Best,

Todd

What's especially nice when you get such good critique is you get a direction on where to go. Rather than do multiple posts let me address everyone here. I appreciate all the comments!

WJames: I'm glad you found elements you liked. As far as the shining eyes part. I do think I need to rework the phrasing a bit and maybe decide how to sequence it. It will be addressed in the next revision hopefully.

baifan: So many good comments here. Metaphor placement works--good. But come up with something more consistent with the emotional flavor of the event--got it. I'm sure it was just how I conceptualized time moving backward that made me think of a very soft image (albeit a little too overused I agree). I'll give it some more thought. Now actually I wanted the shining eyes to be hope in that moment and then move back to a resting state before the event. The rewind went tears, then hope from the speaker's perspective, and then the default state. I'm probably trying to compress too much into too little of a space. I'll give it some thought. Artist: You make some good points. I'll give some thought to an alternative and see if there's anything I like better. White space before the final line: Yeah that's a good idea. That will make it into the next revision. Thank you

nibbed: I appreciate you taking a look. If you have any specific areas you would like me to consider I'd be happy to give them some thought.

Achebe: Yes the original started with the sound of the chair compressing to a single point. It felt unnecessary to me and didn't survive my initial revision. I'll give some thought to your comment on the mascara line, thanks.

Lizzie: You have a good eye for slight edits (down, black, backward). Your take on shining is around what I intended. The answer is to probably kill dry and just imagine the her in the poem happy right before sadness. It fixes a lot of issues. Thank you for being another voice of reason on those commas. Thank you

Keith: Yes the intro needed something a bit odd I was thinking. Pond: Yeah, I think you all are right at best this image is a placeholder for the image that is needed (come on subconscious). Garlic potatoes:  I  see where you're coming from Keith. Again this feels less about incorporating the detail to me and more about pacing. I'll play around with it a bit. Thank you again!

The revision may take a bit to internalize and think about a lot of these points. Thank you all again for engaging with the poem.

Best,

Todd

Todd - about the point: for me it was a standout line in the poem and I did notice it somewhat when you left it out as you can see.

(03-14-2017, 06:51 AM)Achebe Wrote:  Todd - about the point: for me it was a standout line in the poem and I did notice it somewhat when you left it out as you can see.

I'll add it into a previous version on this thread and think about it. I'm doing something right now with the ripple pond language that may allow for me to reintroduce a version of it back into the poem (my astrophysics is weak though so I'm doing some reading at the moment).

Actually I'll just post the original opening here for reference. In this version it was the sound that was the ripple.

The noise of the chair falling
to the ground compresses
and fades into a single point 
in space, a ripple returning 
to the pond’s surface.

(03-14-2017, 07:07 AM)Todd Wrote:  

(03-14-2017, 06:51 AM)Achebe Wrote:  Todd - about the point: for me it was a standout line in the poem and I did notice it somewhat when you left it out as you can see.

I'll add it into a previous version on this thread and think about it. I'm doing something right now with the ripple pond language that may allow for me to reintroduce a version of it back into the poem (my astrophysics is weak though so I'm doing some reading at the moment).

Actually I'll just post the original opening here for reference. In this version it was the sound that was the ripple.

The noise of the chair falling
to the ground compresses
and fades into a single point 
in space, a ripple returning 
to the pond’s surface.

Thanks. Worthwhile for you to reconsider including it, to me, the abstraction of a collapsing sound wave sits nicely between two rather tangible but ordinary images.

I reverted to an earlier version with some modifications (per Achebe). I also made some changes based on the comments. There are some I didn't decide to try yet--though everything is still possible.

I'm going to look at this for a bit. Thoughts? Is this forward progress, a step backward?

Thanks,

Todd

I shall show and not tell this one. It's late and the brain no workie.

I presumptuously inserted whatever of my own style I wished, and I sincerely hope that you eliminate that voice and substitute your own. It'll be better that way. Hopefully, there's something you can harvest from this.

---

The clatter of the chair falling
to the floor compresses and fades
into a single point in space,
a wave returning to it's source.
Streaks of mascara furtively race
up your cheeks to embrace your shining eyes.
With your knife and fork, you remove
the food from your mouth. Like a surgeon,
you reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear
my throat so I cannot say,

“We need to talk.”

Lizzie, what's funny about this is you choose a few of the words i had as place holders right up to posting the revision. Surgeon was sitting there for the longest time. I truly thought that would be the replacement word for artist. I also tried coroner with a few other side changes attached to make that work. Archaeologist also spent a brief time in the spot. I called an audible at the last moment to conductor (who knows why we eventually decide). I'm open to any of those though they all required a few slight lead up changes to make them work.

Clatter is clearly a more specific word than noise and I considered words like that. I decided on noise oddly enough because it is more general. It just felt right in the conceit I'm building (I know that that may not make it right). This was more of a play piano by ear not notes thing for some reason I like the vagueness there. It's hard to explain why I'm making a choice that goes against one of my general rules: choose specific over vague--but there you have it.

The wave returning to it's source part is a nice way to reinsert the ripple idea because it was truly a sound wave. That is a possibility and if I want to reinsert the concept I might take you up on that idea. I also considered supernovas--but it pulled me too far from the simple language choices I favored, and earthquakes got too messy in the setting also pulled the language too far--wave is a nice compromise.

You know technically you're right about the knife. I did debate having the knife reattach the food when I had the surgeon version. I also introduced some precision words and had the knife moving like a sort of reverse scalpel. It is the way to establish the surgeon or the coroner ideas and that is a possibility. I don't mind having that discussion because we're sort of at a late tweaking phase in the revision process and this poem is less about mystery and more about establishing the conceit. So, I don't mind moving in this direction.

Thanks, as you can see, I have thought about some of these exact scenarios and will continue to.

Best,

Todd

(03-15-2017, 04:45 PM)Lizzie Wrote:  I shall show and not tell this one. It's late and the brain no workie.

I presumptuously inserted whatever of my own style I wished, and I sincerely hope that you eliminate that voice and substitute your own. It'll be better that way. Hopefully, there's something you can harvest from this.

---

The clatter of the chair falling
to the floor compresses and fades
into a single point in space,
a wave returning to it's source.
Streaks of mascara furtively race
up your cheeks to embrace your shining eyes.
With your knife and fork, you remove
the food from your mouth. Like a surgeon,
you reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon
with garlic crisp potatoes. I unclear
my throat so I cannot say,

“We need to talk.”

Quote:With your fork, you remove
food from your mouth, and like an artist
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon

Quote:With a fork, you remove
food from your mouth,
and like a conductor reconstruct
the medley of unchewed almond-crusted salmon

Here's why I prefer the artist version:

I get the movement of the hand/fork, then the stop to think about how she is like an artist, then the salmon becomes tiny shards, the way fish flakes, needing to be refit together like a mosaic into a filet.

The conductor version focuses more on the hand/fork motion by elongating it into baton movements and then interrupts reconstruction/salmon with medley, a whole other line of thought, clutter for me. It's interesting and well written but for me the poem loses some immediacy.

I don't think surgeon suits her state of mind, maybe his, but not hers. I hope this helps.

(03-15-2017, 08:34 PM)ellajam Wrote:  

Quote:With your fork, you remove
food from your mouth, and like an artist
reconstruct the unchewed almond-crusted salmon

Quote:With a fork, you remove
food from your mouth,
and like a conductor reconstruct
the medley of unchewed  almond-crusted salmon

Here's why I prefer the artist version:

I get the movement of the hand/fork, then the stop to think about how she is like an artist, then the salmon becomes tiny shards, the way fish flakes, needing to be refit together like a mosaic into a filet.

The conductor version focuses more on the hand/fork motion by elongating it into baton movements and then interrupts reconstruction/salmon with medley, a whole other line of thought, clutter for me. It's interesting and well written but for me the poem loses some immediacy.

I don't think surgeon suits her state of mind, maybe his, but not hers. I hope this helps.

Thanks for wading back into the fray. I get what your saying and artist is still an option. These are all just possibilities, little parallel universes collapsing with each choice. The way I'm looking at it, everything is from the perspective of the speaker. he isn't truly able to understand her point of view, only interpret her reactions. When he is enchanted by the rewind than she is an artist or a conductor. When he is morbid and worried she is a coroner. When he is too caught up and views the process as clinical he sees her as a surgeon. When it seems to mysterious perhaps she is an archeologist or anthropologist. We still learn more about him from the choice and we really no nothing about her. His gaze and perspective is actually very restrictive. 

Your other point shows the strength of artist and possibly archeologist and the like. If the word can stand alone and resists the need for any flourishes than it becomes more immediate and yes that is a strength. Like with everything it is a series of tradeoffs.

I appreciate your perspective on this, Ella.

Best,

Todd

Archeologist is a nice thought, more accurate to my own image (which is what I'm defending here ). I think artist is a more fond way of looking at her, depends on how removed you'd like him to be. IME even at the end there's some fondness.