Posts: 72
Threads: 10
Joined: Dec 2012
Slightly revised version)
An African and European knelt
beneath the same cross.
Sharing a missal, they were
close enough to smell the sweetness
on each other’s breath.
They talked shyly initially,
giggling unnecessarily,
she, unraveling metropolitan inanities
he, extolling the beauty of wildness.
Thus, they came, breathless, into each
other’s lives and reveries.
Shared moments fizzed by, yet not one was missed.
Their liaison, despite its perils, cradled them
and consumed Christmas to crucifixion in the time it took to kiss.
Crossing cultures with bravura,
mixing colours with chutzpah
and with beguiling attention to each other,
spanning the gap of
generations with viaducts
cemented in trust.
They stood, unblinking through storms of bitterness,
siphoning the wind of those racist tempests
toward the fervour they shared.
Fearlessly shouldering burdens and cares into
a blackness, whitened by passion's flare.
But from the flame that lit their route
crackled pernicious, unholy sparks
of condemnation, spat from bloodline mouths.
Viaducts crumbled as truth flaked to dust
Neither chutzpah nor bravura
can restore that lust of spring-time.
Both aware of love gone amiss,
they bought each other missals
to avoid the pungency of halitosis.
Posts: 1,568
Threads: 317
Joined: Jun 2011
(01-26-2013, 02:45 AM)Pete Ak Wrote: African and European knelt -- my concern here is that "European" isn't really an homogenous racial designation and technically, neither is "African" -- while perhaps these terms serve to label the protagonists in a similar manner to society's profiling, I wonder if there's not a better way to say this. For example, "two colours knelt" (without the necessity to specify, since bigots look for any superficial difference anyway)
beneath the same cross.
Over shared missal, they were
close enough to smell the sweetness
on each other’s breath.
They talked shyly initially,
giggling unnecessarily,
she, unraveling metropolitan inanities,
he, extolling the beauty of untamed wildernesses.
They came, breathless, into each other’s
lives and joy-filled reveries. -- this stanza is very innocent and sets the scene well for what is to come
Shared moments fizzed by, yet not one seemed momentary. -- I like moments "fizzing" 
Their liaison, despite its perils, cradled them into bliss
and consumed Christmas to crucifixion in the time it took to kiss. -- great imagery and sounds in this stanza
Crossing cultures with bravura,
mixing colours with chutzpah.
and with beguiling attention to each other,
they spanned generations with viaducts
cemented in trust.
Enduring summer storms of bitterness, -- almost this entire stanza is borderline cliche, though its action is necessary
using the wind of those racist tempests
to fan the flames of the life they shared.
Fearlessly shouldering burdens into winters,
the darkened paths they trod, lit up when passions flared.
But from the fire that lit their route
crackled pernicious, unholy sparks
of condemnation, spat from bloodline mouths.
Viaducts crumbled as truth flaked to dust
Neither bravura nor chutzpah
restores lustful, spring-like expectations.
Both aware of love gone amiss,
they bought each other missals
to avoid the pungency of halitosis. -- concluding with a subversion of the first stanza is inspired and works very well
It could be worse
Posts: 72
Threads: 10
Joined: Dec 2012
Thank you very much Leanne for a useful critique.
You're so right about the beginning, I've tried a few none of which work quite well enough, I've settled with this for now because despite the lack of specificity it does at least introduce the couple, define them and contribute toward an outline identity. I' hoping other critters will have suggestions too. I hope you'll comment on the revision I've made to the cliche-ridden stanza. Hopefully it still serves its purpose even though I use less familiar phrases. There are other more minor word changes elsewhere.
Posts: 1,568
Threads: 317
Joined: Jun 2011
Yes, it still serves its purpose  The words are stronger now, though not overly complicated so what's going on is still clear. I really like "a blackness, whitened by passion's flare" -- that's much more intense than the original. "shouldering burdens" is a rather common phrase but I'm not sure what to suggest instead, or even if it needs replacing.
It could be worse
Posts: 2,602
Threads: 303
Joined: Feb 2017
(01-26-2013, 02:45 AM)Pete Ak Wrote: An African and European knelt I have an immediate problem with this ,pete. You are using contra-general terms. Playing Devil's advocate I could argue that an African could be a European. Perhaps a little tighter definition is needed to set up the opener, which is the quintessence of whatever you are intending doing next
beneath the same cross.
Over shared missal, they were"Over" has a quantitive element which is a bit distracting. Strictly, nothing wrong here though I would like to think they were "holding" or "clutching" the Missal, rather than hovering over its pages. Your poem!
close enough to smell the sweetness
on each other’s breath.
They talked shyly initially,
giggling unnecessarily,Full stop here. You have an excellent sentence. It is complete unto itself. If you go for a semi-colon the next few lines get complicated. I am not good enough to sort the punctuation out without reading out loud. Hang on.....Yep. Full stop gets my vote, then a semi-colon after "inanities". Either way this is a nicely observed cameo and is well worded. Just a hint of cliche with joy-filled but,hell, if no one uses cliches anymore they would become dead as a Do-Do
she, unraveling metropolitan inanities,
he, extolling the beauty of untamed wildernesses.
They came, breathless, into each other’s
lives and joy-filled reveries.
Shared moments fizzed by, not one seeming momentary.I would drop "shared". you have used it already and we get the picture. The rest is heavily reliant upon "fizzed", which works, but then goes flat with the clunking "not one seeming momentary". It us counter-intuitive to the main point of the sentence, that time was effervescing into increasing homogenity, if that's a word.
Their liaison, despite its perils, cradled them into bliss
and consumed Christmas to crucifixion in the time it took to kiss. This last sentence is convoluted BUT it works. Yes to this but no full-stop after "chutzpah" (typo?)
Crossing cultures with bravura,
mixing colours with chutzpah.
and with beguiling attention to each other,
they spanned generations with viaducts
cemented in trust.
They stood, unblinking through storms of bitterness,
siphoning the intensity of those racist tempests
toward the blazing existence they shared.
Fearlessly shouldering burdens and cares into
a blackness, whitened by passion's flare. Why does this stanza seem so familiar? Is it because it is dangerously flirting with cliches again? I just feel that this whole stanza needs bleaching. Cleaning. Hyperbole needs reducing. Its a bit StarTrek-ish.
But from the flame that lit their route
crackled pernicious, unholy sparks
of condemnation, spat from bloodline mouths.
Viaducts crumbled as truth flaked to dustWhy viaducts? I know you wanted to say "bridges" but worried about the cliche call. It is good as it is......but why viaducts?
Neither bravura nor chutzpahToo much with the chutzpah already.
can restore the lust of spring-time.
Both aware of love gone amiss,
they bought each other missals
to avoid the pungency of halitosis. Pete, this is an opinion. Terrible end-line. I don't know what got into you. For me, a very gratuitous ending. Sorry. Made worse because the whole thing is so good. I know what you were aiming for...but I think you missed at the last shot.
Best,
tectak
Posts: 15
Threads: 2
Joined: Jan 2013
I am sympathetic to the basic idea that under-pinning this poem. Also, I really enjoyed some lines, for instance, "cemented in trust." Still, I can't help but feel that some element is missing. I don't sincerely feel the affair between the protagonists, some of the words feel a bit forced which detracts from the overall content of the poem (at least for me).
Posts: 72
Threads: 10
Joined: Dec 2012
Hi tek (may I call you 'tek?) - again thank you for your frank and constructive critique. This response is going to ask for more of your opinons. I have struggled with the opening since starting to write the piece... (it started life as 'slave/mistress but it was a historical piece then; Black / white didn't work and neither does African/European and you've just added more reasons as to why! As the piece changed I focused on the story of a relationship characterized by many differences, colour, age and background (culture) being the three I want to portray. However 'Old / young' wouldn't work and trying to encapsulate cultural differences in two words doesn't strike me as easy either. So I'm still looking for that killer, convincing curtain raiser.
Re the rest of S1 - thanks I've already changed my original in line with your comments.
L1 of S2 needs to be changed - I'm not after homogonousness (sic) so I hope my edit will clarify.
S3 I've already worked on because the cliches were poking out all over. I'll look at this S again.
You ask why 'viaducts'? Well everything I know about the spanning of great open distances (notalot) involves supporting a bridge with a series of linked arches, ie. a viaduct. I prefer the viaduct image, perhaps each arch represents a solution to one of the problem areas, ie. either colour, age or culture. That image hasn't made it into the poem yet but the word 'viaduct' stayed! It also shares a vowel sound with 'dust'.
I wonder if the line 'Neither bravura nor chutzpah' (direct link with a prior statement) would be better as 'Neither chutzpah nor bravura' - is there a guiding principle I can refer to here? (Wondering if no. of syllables in the two prime words should dictate anything?) Or is it simply folly to try and integrate two such unusual words into the same poem twice?
I wonder if my defence of the final line will hold any water with you... I'm of course aware how the line clunks - I didn't intend that but when I read my first attempt I thought, well this last line needs to depict the complete breakdown of a relationship that started so sweetly (nb the 'sweetness' of their breath in S1) so as well as using an inversion of S1's content (sweet breathe - halitosis) I thought the hopelessly stumbling form of the final line would reinforce that image.
If it doesn't work so be it, but I'd appreciate your opinion on both the idea and (if you didn't see it before) whether you're opinion might be tempered a little and/or can it be done more effectively?
Posts: 2,602
Threads: 303
Joined: Feb 2017
(01-30-2013, 05:50 PM)Pete Ak Wrote: Hi tek (may I call you 'tek?) yes- again thank you for your frank and constructive critique. This response is going to ask for more of your opinons. I have struggled with the opening since starting to write the piece... (it started life as 'slave/mistress but it was a historical piece then; Black / white didn't work and neither does African/European and you've just added more reasons as to why! As the piece changed I focused on the story of a relationship characterized by many differences, colour, age and background (culture) being the three I want to portray. However 'Old / young' wouldn't work and trying to encapsulate cultural differences in two words doesn't strike me as easy either. So I'm still looking for that killer, convincing curtain raiser.
Re the rest of S1 - thanks I've already changed my original in line with your comments.Two worlds,together, knelt
beneath the common cross
L1 of S2 needs to be changed - I'm not after homogonousness (sic) so I hope my edit will clarify.I felt that dangerous homogeneity (is that a word?) was exactly what you were aiming for. The complete mixing of two souls,cultures, personnas?
S3 I've already worked on because the cliches were poking out all over. I'll look at this S again.
You ask why 'viaducts'? Well everything I know about the spanning of great open distances (notalot) involves supporting a bridge with a series of linked arches, ie. a viaduct. Can you make alcantara fit? See Stalker below.I prefer the viaduct image, perhaps each arch represents a solution to one of the problem areas, ie. either colour, age or culture. That image hasn't made it into the poem yet but the word 'viaduct' stayed! It also shares a vowel sound with 'dust'.
I wonder if the line 'Neither bravura nor chutzpah' (direct link with a prior statement) would be better as 'Neither chutzpah nor bravura' -Nei/ther chutz/pah nor/bra vu/rah: definitely better than "nei/ther bra/vu rah/nor chutz/pah is there a guiding principle I can refer to here? (Wondering if no. of syllables in the two prime words should dictate anything?) Or is it simply folly to try and integrate two such unusual words into the same poem twice?
I wonder if my defence of the final line will hold any water with you... I'm of course aware how the line clunks - I didn't intend that but when I read my first attempt I thought, well this last line needs to depict the complete breakdown of a relationship that started so sweetly (nb the 'sweetness' of their breath in S1) so as well as using an inversion of S1's content (sweet breathe - halitosis) I thought the hopelessly stumbling form of the final line would reinforce that image.
If it doesn't work so be it, but I'd appreciate your opinion on both the idea and (if you didn't see it before) whether you're opinion might be tempered a little and/or can it be done more effectively?Leaving a "bad taste" in one's mouth I could metaphorically accept but though (and because) you make a point of mentioning their sweet breath earlier the contra-point is lost as it does not seem to be a natural follow-on. There are medical terms for "bad taste" and if you can find the one that suits( a kiss deterrent, for example), this would, I think be far more moot......halitosis stinks  Best,
TECtak
Posts: 67
Threads: 7
Joined: Jan 2013
an aqueduct carries water - a viaduct carries a road or possibly a train.
Posts: 2,602
Threads: 303
Joined: Feb 2017
(01-30-2013, 08:16 PM)Stalker Wrote: an aqueduct carries water - a viaduct carries a road or possibly a train.
You are absolutely correct. I had a mental block! I wouldn't care but I googled my answer and STILL got it wrong. I am getting old. Thanks. I will correct before pete sees it but you can grass me up if you like....I deserve it 
Best,
tectak
Posts: 72
Threads: 10
Joined: Dec 2012
I thought 'viaduct' referred to the arch-like shape of the support structure of a bridge as opposed to the bridge itself. No matter, I'm leaving this one alone for a while.
Thanks for your thoughts though, very much appreciated.
Respect. Pete Ak
|