mango

[popeye]

mango

just picked this mango
from under its tree
brought it up a bit closer to see
its peach and rose blush
firm, yielding to touch
the bouquet's a rush

fully ripe, darling
just like you
out of touch

i lift the peel gently
from soft amber flesh
and mouthing it's softness
right to the seed
I'm eating this mango
but it's you that I need

you're at the office
to fund our love grove
the fruits of our labours
indeed a rich trove
juice is now running
down my forearm and chin
teasing the fibres out
just for a whim
thoughts rambling wildly
out of the blue
oh babe
I'm so lost without you



Been edited with Leanne's recommendations thank you Mark, Erthona, grannyjill and Aish for your suggestions they were much appreciated, cheers :-)

[Erthona]

I think it is fairly disruptive to the reading that you do not stay with the two foot line of the first two line:

"just picked this mango
from under it's tree"

As the overall metaphor is stable, and you have good images, it is only the rhythm that sabotages you here.

Dale

[grannyjill]

Quick comment, jiminy, so you can do a swift edit....most of your 'it's' should be 'its' (it's means - it is)

[popeye]

I think it is fairly disruptive to the reading that you do not stay with the two foot line of the first two line:

"just picked this mango
from under it's tree"

As the overall metaphor is stable, and you have good images, it is only the rhythm that sabotages you here.

Dale

Thank you very much for the crit. Dale it's pointed me in the right direction, I've always enjoyed poetry but never tried to compose so haven't taken much interest in the technicalities, now I have a lot of catching up to do, hoping you have a Merry Christmas, cheers
jiminy

---

Quick comment, jiminy, so you can do a swift edit....most of your 'it's' should be 'its' (it's means - it is)

Merry Christmas grannyjill, thank you for the crit. you must be wearying of my adamant refusal to punctuate correctly will be more careful in future, have a great Christmas, cheers.

jiminy

[Erthona]

Even though I had written poetry since age 4, I was attracted to it more as I approached my twenties because my grammar skills were so poor, and I thought that you didn't need grammar in poetry. I wrote very "free verse" stick to the wall poetry. That is I just crammed a bunch of words or cool sounding phrases together, through it against the wall to see what stuck. Fortunately I was part of a writing group whose other three members had PhD's in English. If I was young today, I would never progress with all the wonderful "support" for mediocrity that permeates most of the larger poetry sites. However, because they chewed my ass for being unclear, ungrammatical, unintentionally ambiguous, and other egregious writing faults such as poor punctuation and typography, I can even do passably well in prose today, as well as poetry. I think I am now about where I should have been going into college. Let me tell you, one can progress a lot faster with computers and the internet, than typewriters and a stack of reference books. I actually use to use the grammar checker in Word quite a lot and it showed me some poor patterns that I repeated often. Of course it also spouts a lot of garbage, but that just forced me to look up what it was talking about and why. Grammar in English is insane because not until right before I finished high school, we still thought that English came from Latin like French, Spanish, or Italian. Unfortunately, it took us that long to realize that English is Germanic in origin, and it only has all these Latin root based words because of the French Norman invasion of 1066 (bloody French!). Now we are still in the process of creating grammar through backward engineering.

Something you might want to try is called, accentual verse. You count the accents in a line, rather than trying to write in a meter such as iambic. Of course anyone who wants to call themselves a poet, should be well versed (pun intended) in all of the major forms, most of which in English involve iambic, trochee, or dactyl. In Wiki under poetry, these is a list of the basic meters, and if you go to the specific article, there will usually be examples. On line dictionaries usually show a rudimentary stress guide, especially on multi-syllable words. One of the things that has benefited myself was reading examples of a particular form and then trying to compose in that form. Iambic tetrameter is one of the easiest, either that or Ballad meter. Of course a lot of it has to do with ones ear, and how well you hear the rhythm/cadence/beat.

Merry Christmas

Dale

[Aish]

We have a reference forum here on the Pig. Leanne has taken great strides to provide excellent tutorials on narratives, forms and types of poetry, enjambment, poetic devices, terminology, etc.
She is quite qualified to help mold and critique young writers, seeing as how she holds masters degrees in creative writing and cultural theory, and she is a well know published poet.
Mediocrity is not practiced here. Neither is snobbery. We strive to keep a positive, grounded workshop environment that nurtures poets as well as friendships in tandem with constructive criticism.

The Poetry Reference Forumhttp://pigpenpoetry.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=41

We also have a library of established/classic poets that is growing every week for reading pleasure and comparison.

http://pigpenpoetry.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=46

/mod

[Wildcard]

Hi Jiminy,
My thoughts are just that- thoughts. I am no poet- not really. I am just learning to write and critique. Like Dale's sig says, don't take it to heart, but maybe there is something in my words that can help. If not, well at least I trie

mango

just picked this mango --Just a thought, but I think it might be better to either change the title of the poem or eliminate the word 'mango' from the first line. It seems redundant, especially when the title is viewed just above the poem. jmo
from under its tree
brought it up closer to see
its peach and rose blush --beautiful
it's firm yet pliant to touch
the bouquet giving a rush
fully ripe darling
just like you
you're out of touch
lifting the peel gently --because of the human/fruit comparison, what about 'skin' instead of peel?
from this amber soft flesh
and mouthing it's softness
right to the seed
I'm eating this mango
but it's you that I need
you're at the office
helping to fund our love grove
the fruits of our labours --made me smile. It seems like a pun to me
indeed a rich trove
juice is now running
down my forearm and chin
teasing the fibres out --I'm not getting 'fibres', but then again I can be thick
just for a whim
thoughts rambling wildly
out of the blue
oh babe
I'm so lost without you --Honestly, this is a little cliche, imo. I think you might need to work on the ending.

Thanks for sharing.

[popeye]

We have a reference forum here on the Pig. Leanne has taken great strides to provide excellent tutorials on narratives, forms and types of poetry, enjambment, poetic devices, terminology, etc.
She is quite qualified to help mold and critique young writers, seeing as how she holds masters degrees in creative writing and cultural theory, and she is a well know published poet.
Mediocrity is not practiced here. Neither is snobbery. We strive to keep a positive, grounded workshop environment that nurtures poets as well as friendships in tandem with constructive criticism.

The Poetry Reference Forumhttp://pigpenpoetry.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=41

We also have a library of established/classic poets that is growing every week for reading pleasure and compari

[color=#FF0000]http://pigpenpoetry.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=46

/mod

Thank you very much for taking the time in giving me all that information Aish it is most helpful, Merry Christmas, cheers

jiminy

---

Hi Jiminy,
My thoughts are just that- thoughts. I am no poet- not really. I am just learning to write and critique. Like Dale's sig says, don't take it to heart, but maybe there is something in my words that can help. If not, well at least I trie

mango

just picked this mango --Just a thought, but I think it might be better to either change the title of the poem or eliminate the word 'mango' from the first line. It seems redundant, especially when the title is viewed just above the poem. jmo (thought it was a good way to introduce the title, but you've got me thinking )
from under its tree
brought it up closer to see
its peach and rose blush --beautiful (thanks, they are a nice looking fruit)
it's firm yet pliant to touch
the bouquet giving a rush
fully ripe darling
just like you
you're out of touch
lifting the peel gently --because of the human/fruit comparison, what about 'skin' instead of peel? ( was trying to be a bit erotic here, peel as in 'peeling down panties')
from this amber soft flesh
and mouthing it's softness
right to the seed
I'm eating this mango
but it's you that I need
you're at the office
helping to fund our love grove
the fruits of our labours --made me smile. It seems like a pun to me(it is a pun and I'm an incurable punster, but point taken Mark, not very original!)
indeed a rich trove
juice is now running
down my forearm and chin
teasing the fibres out --I'm not getting 'fibres', but then again I can be thick( an erotic reference to pubic hairs )
just for a whim
thoughts rambling wildly
out of the blue
oh babe
I'm so lost without you --Honestly, this is a little cliche, imo. I think you might need to work on the ending.(I'm emo by nature and have a lot of work to do in this area to balance it all out, all good points Mark, thanks)

Thanks for sharing.

Hello Mark, your comments are most welcome champ and I'm happy to accept critique from everyone no matter what their qualifications the wider the net, the better the knowledge, and then it's just a matter of choice, Merry Christmas, cheers

[Erthona]

Babel

When we dilute our values
through accommodation,
and lose our integrity:
as sinks a ship, so does a nation.

Common cause has been that
which keeps ages from growing dark,
in language we find the cause,
to stand together or fall apart.

No surprise American feels kin
to the English, instead of the French.
When in need, England stood with us,
while the others rode the fence.

It imparts a common vision,
this common language, thick as blood,
making sense from confusion,
making bricks from formless mud.

Subtly, it reflects our shared values,
distinguishes civil from the rabble,
when God wanted disunity
he removed their common language,
and thus created Babel.


©2011 ~Erthona

[Leanne]

Jiminy, there have been very good points made about the importance of rhythm -- even freeverse is improved with a driving meter, which need not be regular, it just helps the sounds fall in ways more pleasing to the ear and adds to the mood of the piece, as well as making certain parts stand out. Without altering too many of your lines or really taking any parts out, I'll just make some alternative line suggestions so you can compare and decide for yourself.

mango

just picked this mango
from under its tree
brought it up a bit closer to see
its peach and rose blush
firm, yielding to touch
the bouquet is a rush

fully ripe, darling
just like you
out of touch

i lift the peel gently
from soft amber flesh
and mouthing it's softness
right to the seed
I'm eating this mango
but it's you that I need

you're at the office
to fund our love grove
the fruits of our labours
indeed a rich trove
juice is now running
down my forearm and chin
teasing the fibres out
just for a whim
thoughts rambling wildly
out of the blue
oh babe
I'm so lost without you

[popeye]

Thanks very much for the comments and example Leanne, the poem is about a young couple who move out to a bush block and try to start a mango orchard, she works in an office in the city while he tries to set up the farm, and in a fit of loneliness he grabs a mango.............

But it started to get a bit convoluted and untidy!

Yielding is nice, much better!

Do you think perhaps 'bouquet's' might flow better?

Love what you did with the second stanza, its brevity works well to introduce the rest of the poem!

Really I couldn't do any better than that Leanne so reckon I might just leave it that!

Cheers, jiminy

[Leanne]

I think your meaning comes through very clearly actually, that's pretty much the same as what I got from the poem. Well, with the exception of knowing that the orchard is on their own block... not quite sure how to make that detail clearer as yet, or even if you need to.

Bouquet's will work very nicely

[popeye]

Thanks Leanne, I'll just make that small change, and leave well enough alone, cheers

[popeye]

Babel

When we dilute our values
through accommodation,
and lose our integrity:
as sinks a ship, so does a nation.

Common cause has been that
which keeps ages from growing dark,
in language we find the cause, I y
to stand together or fall apart.

No surprise American feels kin
to the English, instead of the French.
When in need, England stood with us,
while the others rode the fence.

It imparts a common vision,
this common language, thick as blood,
making sense from confusion,
making bricks from formless mud.

Subtly, it reflects our shared values,
distinguishes civil from the rabble,
when God wanted disunity
he removed their common language,
and thus created Babel.


©2011 ~Erthona

That's very good Dale, it shows quite clearly how good structure and rhythm work together for the enjoyment of poetry thanks very much for taking the time to show me.

I notice your copyright at the bottom, is it from an anthology?

Cheers, jiminy

[grannyjill]

Only one comment -

I keep reading this bit

"fully ripe, darling
just like you
out of touch"
as
"fully ripe, darling
just like you
out of reach"

no one else has mentioned it, so maybe it is just me...do you actually mean that the mango isn't up to date with the latest trends? The latter makes more sense for me, even though the mango is there at your feet!

[popeye]

Only one comment -

I keep reading this bit

"fully ripe, darling
just like you
out of touch"
as
"fully ripe, darling
just like you
out of reach"

no one else has mentioned it, so maybe it is just me...do you actually mean that the mango isn't up to date with the latest trends? The latter makes more sense for me, even though the mango is there at your feet!

Grannyjill I only really wanted a mango, dates never entered my mind except keeping one with the babe in the poem

Seriously though I see what you mean, I was trying for a sensual flow and felt 'touch' would meld better with the other words and so morph somehow with the people. Here in Oz we frequently use the word touch in our communication as in: I'll be in touch, let's get in touch, etc.

Cheers, jiminy