Two Orphans Meet edit 0.0001chris

[tectak]

Two Orphans Meet

Cry small baby, baby boy. Cry into the empty night.
I will hold you like my mother held me to her, held me tight.
Sky above  bursts bright with fury, earth below lit red and bare;
do not touch the blue-steel saviour, heat of conflict lingers there.

Heat of conflict lingers there, reminder of the sting of death.
Blood has stained you, flame has burned you, smoke has raked your infant breath.
Breathe for me, tomorrow's soldier; you and I will share night's pain;
I can only stay 'til dawning, then we'll be alone again.

I can only stay 'til dawning, hear the nearing battle roar.
We will sleep until the morning, I can't promise any more.
When I leave you, make no murmur; 'neath god's eyes lie safe and still.
Curse me when I still your brothers... but it is war I try to kill.

tectak 2014

[ChristopherSea]

Greetings Tom,

This is the first poem of yours that I have read in 2015! It's a poignant piece, but I may have more questions than advice.
First, I don’t quite see the title herein. Is one of the two a baby boy and the other an older girl or is she some incarnate form of death?
If so, how is she an orphan?  If she 'stills his brothers', she must be some otherworldly figure and probably not an orphan either.

Do you need a full stop in the opener, would another comma suffice? What about exchanging one of those three 'hold's for something else (grasp or clutch).
If you must keep them all, 'hold you dearly' or something in that vein may come off less repetitive, while reinforcing 'like a mother stated' previously.

The ‘Sky above us…’ line may call for a verb or comma: Sky above us, bright with fury or Sky above is bright with fury

Why not: ‘lingering like the sting of death’.  

I think ‘baby’s breath’ would be more effective and provide double entendre in reference to both the flower and babe.

In line 8, ‘then you’ll’ may flow better.

The pain/again rhyme comes off as either a forced rhyme (I have to force myself to say 'a-gane' and not 'a-gen') or slant rhyme for me,
but that is probably due to a pronunciation difference between poet and reader.

Your use of anastrophe works, so I contend you not! Perhaps Dale will... 

These are probably minor observations/suggestions. See what you think. It’s a moving poem regardless./Chris

[tectak]

Greetings Tom,

This is the first poem of yours that I have read in 2015! It's a poignant piece, but I may have more questions than advice.
First, I don’t quite see the title herein. Is one of the two a baby boy and the other an older girl or is she some incarnate form of death?
If so, how is she an orphan?  If she 'stills his brothers', she must be some otherworldly figure and probably not an orphan either.

Do you need a full stop in the opener, would another comma suffice? What about exchanging one of those three 'hold's for something else (grasp or clutch).
If you must keep them all, 'hold you dearly' or something in that vein may come off less repetitive, while reinforcing 'like a mother stated' previously.

The ‘Sky above us…’ line may call for a verb or comma: Sky above us, bright with fury or Sky above is bright with fury

Why not: ‘lingering like the sting of death’.  

I think ‘baby’s breath’ would be more effective and provide double entendre in reference to both the flower and babe.

In line 8, ‘then you’ll’ may flow better.

The pain/again rhyme comes off as either a forced rhyme (I have to force myself to say 'a-gane' and not 'a-gen') or slant rhyme for me,
but that is probably due to a pronunciation difference between poet and reader.

Your use of anastrophe works, so I contend you not! Perhaps Dale will... 

These are probably minor observations/suggestions. See what you think. It’s a moving poem regardless./Chris

Hi chris,
in a bloody rush. Thanks so far.
Think soldier holed up with a baby orphaned by war, in the war zone. Shit happens.
Tectak

[ChristopherSea]

Greetings Tom,

This is the first poem of yours that I have read in 2015! It's a poignant piece, but I may have more questions than advice.
First, I don’t quite see the title herein. Is one of the two a baby boy and the other an older girl or is she some incarnate form of death?
If so, how is she an orphan?  If she 'stills his brothers', she must be some otherworldly figure and probably not an orphan either.

Do you need a full stop in the opener, would another comma suffice? What about exchanging one of those three 'hold's for something else (grasp or clutch).
If you must keep them all, 'hold you dearly' or something in that vein may come off less repetitive, while reinforcing 'like a mother stated' previously.

The ‘Sky above us…’ line may call for a verb or comma: Sky above us, bright with fury or Sky above is bright with fury

Why not: ‘lingering like the sting of death’.  

I think ‘baby’s breath’ would be more effective and provide double entendre in reference to both the flower and babe.

In line 8, ‘then you’ll’ may flow better.

The pain/again rhyme comes off as either a forced rhyme (I have to force myself to say 'a-gane' and not 'a-gen') or slant rhyme for me,
but that is probably due to a pronunciation difference between poet and reader.

Your use of anastrophe works, so I contend you not! Perhaps Dale will... 

These are probably minor observations/suggestions. See what you think. It’s a moving poem regardless./Chris

Hi chris,
in a bloody rush. Thanks so far.
Think soldier holed up with a baby orphaned by war, in the war zone. I happens.
Tectak

 Of course, for some reason my mind would not allow an orphan to grow to be an adult. Additionally, my head
wouldn’t permit a soldier to have the empathy of a mother! Nonetheless, you could consider using ‘father’.
It should be as effective and less misdirecting.

[bena]

Um, yeah. This one befuddles me, dear tom. I like the idea of it, but in general you've fallen into the old simple end rhyme game--every single one is predictable.

blood has stained you, flame has burned you---really? Do I need to get out my cliche hose?
and yet the following words "smoke has raked your infant breath" is one of the most stunning in this piece. How do I get that Tec to write the rest?

L2 was awkward for me rhythmically, but that could just be me.

Curse me when I still your brothers... but it is war I try to kill. <>
something ain't right but I don't know how to fix it without knowing your intentions.

You know I love your writing and I rarely criticize but this one needs some work, dear. I'm certainly not the person to tell you what it needs though.

Love ya,
mel.

[tectak]

Um, yeah.  This one befuddles me, dear tom.  I like the idea of it, but in general you've fallen into the old simple end rhyme game--every single one is predictable.

blood has stained you, flame has burned you---really?  Do I need to get out my cliche hose?
and yet the following words "smoke has raked your infant breath" is one of the most stunning in this piece.  How do I get that Tec to write the rest?

L2 was awkward for me rhythmically, but that could just be me.

Curse me when I still your brothers... but it is war I try to kill. <>
something ain't right but I don't know how to fix it without knowing your intentions.

You know I love your writing and I rarely criticize but this one needs some work, dear.  I'm certainly not the person to tell you what it needs though.  

Love ya,
mel.

Hi bena,
thanks for ALL of this. I often write backwards. I have the end before the beginning. A bit like a Columbo mystery. I call it commitment verse to make it acceptable...mostly it works and no one questions me on the principle. Mostly. I cannot, though, be more me than me so WYSIWYG  I have developed an excuse for close-cliche by blaming the character's limited word power...I may be wrong (shut up, he explained) but if it is necessary to clothe a character in cliche to add veracity then so be it. I still hear you.
To still. Acceptable verb in common usage which can mean to render immobile. Is it a stretch to translate this as "to kill", which in itself can mean to  stop, cease or end an action. I liked the contrivance of it but accept it could be over-egged. We shall see.
It's not over...thanks for your input.
Best,
tectak

[Leah S.]

Two Orphans Meet
Cry small baby, baby boy. Cry into the empty night. But it's not empty, it's full of ruin, explosions, chaos.
I will hold you like my mother held me to her, held me tight. There's room to fiddle here, lose 'to her' and maybe 'I will hold you' and find a way to imply that it's a grown man telling a boy how his mother held him as a child.
Sky above  bursts bright with fury, earth below lit red and bare; Needs a better image than 'bright with fury,' maybe something that further describes bursting.....?
do not touch the blue-steel saviour, heat of conflict lingers there. All I could think of was an unexploded bomb, but why would anyone run out into a bombardment to touch it? I like the phrase 'blue-steel saviour' and I think you must too, because you're forcing it in where it has to struggle to belong.
Heat of conflict lingers there, reminder of the sting of death. Cliché. sorry. Shakespeare was also alluding to a familiar bible verse about 'the sting of death is sin.' I'm afraid modern readers won't get it, even if that was your intent.
Blood has stained you, flame has burned you, smoke has raked your infant breath. I like this line, especially the last phrase. Plain and grim.
Breathe for me, tomorrow's soldier; you and I will share night's pain; I couldn't help it, 'Breathe for me' called to mind the TV EMT doing CPR.
I can only stay 'til dawning, then we'll be alone again.
I can only stay 'til dawning, hear the nearing battle roar.
We will sleep until the morning, I can't promise any more.
When I leave you, make no murmur; 'neath god's eyes lie safe and still. Lose 'neath please. How about "....make no sound; beneath...."
Curse me when I still your brothers... but it is war I try to kill. I had no trouble with 'still' as a verb.
tectak 2014

I like this poem's subject, but it is already somewhat of a cliché. Many movies exploit this theme of the enemy's child as a victim of war, temporarily comforted by the exhausted soldier. Transcend the cliché and make it as poignant as it deserves to be. At least the soldier didn't kill the child in your poem, and live a tortured life afterward.

[tectak]

Two Orphans Meet
Cry small baby, baby boy. Cry into the empty night. But it's not empty, it's full of ruin, explosions, chaos.
I will hold you like my mother held me to her, held me tight. There's room to fiddle here, lose 'to her' and maybe 'I will hold you' and find a way to imply that it's a grown man telling a boy how his mother held him as a child.
Sky above  bursts bright with fury, earth below lit red and bare; Needs a better image than 'bright with fury,' maybe something that further describes bursting.....?
do not touch the blue-steel saviour, heat of conflict lingers there. All I could think of was an unexploded bomb, but why would anyone run out into a bombardment to touch it? I like the phrase 'blue-steel saviour' and I think you must too, because you're forcing it in where it has to struggle to belong.
Heat of conflict lingers there, reminder of the sting of death. Cliché. sorry. Shakespeare was also alluding to a familiar bible verse about 'the sting of death is sin.' I'm afraid modern readers won't get it, even if that was your intent.
Blood has stained you, flame has burned you, smoke has raked your infant breath. I like this line, especially the last phrase. Plain and grim.
Breathe for me, tomorrow's soldier; you and I will share night's pain; I couldn't help it, 'Breathe for me' called to mind the TV EMT doing CPR.
I can only stay 'til dawning, then we'll be alone again.
I can only stay 'til dawning, hear the nearing battle roar.
We will sleep until the morning, I can't promise any more.
When I leave you, make no murmur; 'neath god's eyes lie safe and still. Lose 'neath please. How about "....make no sound; beneath...."
Curse me when I still your brothers... but it is war I try to kill. I had no trouble with 'still' as a verb.
tectak 2014

I like this poem's subject, but it is already somewhat of a cliché. Many movies exploit this theme of the enemy's child as a victim of war, temporarily comforted by the exhausted soldier. Transcend the cliché and make it as poignant as it deserves to be. At least the soldier didn't kill the child in your poem, and live a tortured life afterward.

Yea...I'm a sucker for scrappy endings. There's only so much I can stand of myself in this mode. The cliche is endlessly expressed...like the holocaust. Maybe that should tell me something, but apart from the occasional prod of indignation I steer clear of anything which lets the reader take sides...after all, you could be the baby .
On the semantics, I hear you and will take view.
The blue steel saviour is a crap euphemism  (gun. His gun) in the same vein as the wooden padre or full metal jacket...I heard it from a friend who got out of  Para2 after too long in NI, where even JC had a modified  body...bread? You must be kidding me.
neath will go. Thanks.
Sting of death is a reference fulcrum which I hoped I would get away by the "reminder" suggestion. Sting is the sin, power of sin is law. Is it biblical in origin? Google calls.
Empty night. The calm before the storm. Distant flashes, coming war. Flash in sky appears as slow glow due to multiple explosions. I have witnessed it (Slovenia 1991 from Italian border north of Pulfero)...no noise, it goes overhead due to temperature stratification in  cold nights.
Excellent crit.
Best,
tectak

[tectak]

Two Orphans Meet
Cry small baby, baby boy. Cry into the empty night. But it's not empty, it's full of ruin, explosions, chaos.
I will hold you like my mother held me to her, held me tight. There's room to fiddle here, lose 'to her' and maybe 'I will hold you' and find a way to imply that it's a grown man telling a boy how his mother held him as a child.
Sky above  bursts bright with fury, earth below lit red and bare; Needs a better image than 'bright with fury,' maybe something that further describes bursting.....?
do not touch the blue-steel saviour, heat of conflict lingers there. All I could think of was an unexploded bomb, but why would anyone run out into a bombardment to touch it? I like the phrase 'blue-steel saviour' and I think you must too, because you're forcing it in where it has to struggle to belong.
Heat of conflict lingers there, reminder of the sting of death. Cliché. sorry. Shakespeare was also alluding to a familiar bible verse about 'the sting of death is sin.' I'm afraid modern readers won't get it, even if that was your intent.
Blood has stained you, flame has burned you, smoke has raked your infant breath. I like this line, especially the last phrase. Plain and grim.
Breathe for me, tomorrow's soldier; you and I will share night's pain; I couldn't help it, 'Breathe for me' called to mind the TV EMT doing CPR.
I can only stay 'til dawning, then we'll be alone again.
I can only stay 'til dawning, hear the nearing battle roar.
We will sleep until the morning, I can't promise any more.
When I leave you, make no murmur; 'neath god's eyes lie safe and still. Lose 'neath please. How about "....make no sound; beneath...."
Curse me when I still your brothers... but it is war I try to kill. I had no trouble with 'still' as a verb.
tectak 2014

I like this poem's subject, but it is already somewhat of a cliché. Many movies exploit this theme of the enemy's child as a victim of war, temporarily comforted by the exhausted soldier. Transcend the cliché and make it as poignant as it deserves to be. At least the soldier didn't kill the child in your poem, and live a tortured life afterward.

Yea...I'm a sucker for scrappy endings. There's only so much I can stand of myself in this mode. The cliche is endlessly expressed...like the holocaust. Maybe that should tell me something, but apart from the occasional prod of indignation I steer clear of anything which lets the reader take sides...after all, you could be the baby .
On the semantics, I hear you and will take view.
The blue steel saviour is a crap euphemism  (gun. His gun) in the same vein as the wooden padre or full metal jacket...I heard it from a friend who got out of  Para2 after too long in NI, where even JC had a modified  body...bread? You must be kidding me.
neath will go. Thanks.
Sting of death is a reference fulcrum which I hoped I would get away by the "reminder" suggestion. Sting is the sin, power of sin is law. Is it biblical in origin? Google calls.
Empty night. The calm before the storm. Distant flashes, coming war. Flash in sky appears as slow glow due to multiple explosions. I have witnessed it (Slovenia 1991 from Italian border north of Pulfero)...no noise, it goes overhead due to temperature stratification in  cold nights.
Excellent crit.
Best,
tectak

Hi leah,
I have tried every which way to get rid of "'neath"....I have forgotten why I agreed to do it. Your "murmur" suggestion breaks meter ( it's not just syllable counting, you know ) and that would never do...so on balance it stays.
Very best,
tectak

[Leah S.]

I like this poem's subject, but it is already somewhat of a cliché. Many movies exploit this theme of the enemy's child as a victim of war, temporarily comforted by the exhausted soldier. Transcend the cliché and make it as poignant as it deserves to be. At least the soldier didn't kill the child in your poem, and live a tortured life afterward.

Yea...I'm a sucker for scrappy endings. There's only so much I can stand of myself in this mode. The cliche is endlessly expressed...like the holocaust. Maybe that should tell me something, but apart from the occasional prod of indignation I steer clear of anything which lets the reader take sides...after all, you could be the baby .
On the semantics, I hear you and will take view.
The blue steel saviour is a crap euphemism  (gun. His gun) in the same vein as the wooden padre or full metal jacket...I heard it from a friend who got out of  Para2 after too long in NI, where even JC had a modified  body...bread? You must be kidding me.
neath will go. Thanks.
Sting of death is a reference fulcrum which I hoped I would get away by the "reminder" suggestion. Sting is the sin, power of sin is law. Is it biblical in origin? Google calls.
Empty night. The calm before the storm. Distant flashes, coming war. Flash in sky appears as slow glow due to multiple explosions. I have witnessed it (Slovenia 1991 from Italian border north of Pulfero)...no noise, it goes overhead due to temperature stratification in  cold nights.
Excellent crit.
Best,
tectak

Hi leah,
I have tried every which way to get rid of "'neath"....I have forgotten why I agreed to do it. Your "murmur" suggestion breaks meter ( it's not just syllable counting, you know ) and that would never do...so on balance it stays.
Very best,
tectak

"When I leave you, make no murmur; 'neath god's eyes lie safe and still."
I don't see why my suggestion breaks the meter. "Sound" carries the accent just as "mur" in "murmur" does, and the "be" in "beneath" is the unaccented syllable.
When I leave you, make no mur   mur; 'neath god's eyes lie safe and still.
When I leave you, make no sound; be   neath god's eyes lie safe and still.
And, in mine, the accent shift is more symmetrical too.

[tectak]

Yea...I'm a sucker for scrappy endings. There's only so much I can stand of myself in this mode. The cliche is endlessly expressed...like the holocaust. Maybe that should tell me something, but apart from the occasional prod of indignation I steer clear of anything which lets the reader take sides...after all, you could be the baby .
On the semantics, I hear you and will take view.
The blue steel saviour is a crap euphemism  (gun. His gun) in the same vein as the wooden padre or full metal jacket...I heard it from a friend who got out of  Para2 after too long in NI, where even JC had a modified  body...bread? You must be kidding me.
neath will go. Thanks.
Sting of death is a reference fulcrum which I hoped I would get away by the "reminder" suggestion. Sting is the sin, power of sin is law. Is it biblical in origin? Google calls.
Empty night. The calm before the storm. Distant flashes, coming war. Flash in sky appears as slow glow due to multiple explosions. I have witnessed it (Slovenia 1991 from Italian border north of Pulfero)...no noise, it goes overhead due to temperature stratification in  cold nights.
Excellent crit.
Best,
tectak

Hi leah,
I have tried every which way to get rid of "'neath"....I have forgotten why I agreed to do it. Your "murmur" suggestion breaks meter ( it's not just syllable counting, you know ) and that would never do...so on balance it stays.
Very best,
tectak

"When I leave you, make no murmur; 'neath god's eyes lie safe and still."
I don't see why my suggestion breaks the meter. "Sound" carries the accent just as "mur" in "murmur" does, and the "be" in "beneath" is the unaccented syllable.
When I leave you, make no mur   mur; 'neath god's eyes lie safe and still.
When I leave you, make no sound; be   neath god's eyes lie safe and still.
And, in mine, the accent shift is more symmetrical too.

Of course, leah, you are correct in how you determine syllable count and I would not argue on mathematical certainty...my concern is the "sound;be"  trochee with the important semicolon pause right in the middle This is a common problem when a writer chooses to let the trochee/ iamb desire overule the sense inherent in "whole" words. It works in song where the "tune" can force the emphases....but I don't like it in poetry. There are many examples. My favourite is in "What a difference a day makes". It's heaven whenyou.....find romance on your men u. Love it...but try metering it
Best,
tectak