Red Plague

[J.C. Fontenot]

A concrete fallacy plagues the youth,
forsaken bonds of brotherhood,
steers its way up the crimson slough.

Layers, veiling the absolute,
the uprooting of stability
threaten to grab helm,
man against man,
man against nature,
man against himself;
a timeless battle,
pitted against mountain and sea
sparring apparitions cloaked as warriors
weilding naught, but dreams of immortality

drop the malicious tyranny
disguised as eden, my youth.
the fallacies of man end in in blood, this is definite
for the absolute is tangible
and without need for veils

scribbled in history
there is a dream of recurrence
nobility, without persona, meets man
an everlasting truce,
creating infinity in the finite, ensues
this, my youth,
the palpable truth



*i understand the format is rough, please post on the context and evoking emotion more than the structure of my poem, this is not my finished product of format*

[just mercedes]

A concrete fallacy plagues the youth,
forsaken bonds of brotherhood,
steer its way up the crimson slough. 'bonds' plural, so should be 'their way'
Layers, veiling the absolute,
the uprooting of stability
threatens to grab helm, 'layers' is plural, so the verb should be 'threaten'.
man against man,
man against nature,
man against himself;
a timeless battle,
pitted against mountain and sea
sparring apparitions cloaked as warriors
weilding naught, but dreams of immortality 'wielding'? How do you wield a dream?
drop the malicious tyranny
disguised as eden, my youth.
the fallacies of man end in in blood, this is definite
for the absolute is tangible
and without need for veils
scribbled in history
there is a dream of recurrence
nobility, without persona, meets man
an everlasting truce,
creating infinity in the finite, ensues
this, my youth,
the palpable truth



*i understand the format is rough, please post on the context and evoking emotion more than the structure of my poem, this is not my finished product of format*

Hi J.C. - Welcome aboard. I think this is the first poem of yours I've read. I'm not a big fan of abstractions - I prefer to let concrete images do the work. A 'concrete fallacy' is still an abstraction. I'm sorry but I have no more idea what your poem is about, after having read it, than I had before I started. 

[J.C. Fontenot]

--thank you for your opinion. as much as you dislike abstractions, is how much i love them.
--This poem is about the fallacy that the world is teaching children is the right way(in this poem, i am going in opposition with this fallacy). such as racism, hatred, a fear of an authority, a fear of life in general.
the first stanza is basically "a bond of forsaken brotherhood" meaning the bond we have as humans is being forsaken, because of wars amongst other humans, as the "forsakeness"(abstraction) is riding along a shallow swampy river of blood "red slough" portraying blood spilled due to the forsaken bond...
--the second stanza begins by saying that the "uprooting of stability threatens to grab helm"...by this, i am offering light from the dark thoughts of this fallacy continuing endlessly by saying that to uproot the stablity(stability here meaning the state of fallacy that humans have been living in forever) threatens to take control of the "boat" going up the red slough. i am saying that the act of not living in the fallacy "threatens" to come into existence and change the fate of endless wars and bloodshed.
in the later lines, the words are portraying an image of battles humans have such as against nature, another human, and ourselves. it is a timeless battle because these battles have been obviously going since the beginning of time. the battle is pitted against mountain and sea because the fact that these battles have been going on for centuries and no victor has been declared...
how can one wield dreams of immortality? well speaking metaphorically, one can wield anything that he thinks will keep him alive during a battle, the only reason people wage wars is to be the greatest and immortalize themselves. wars are being fought by "apparitions cloaked as warriors" because aren't we all doomed to be apparitions in the end?
--the third stanza is showing how tyrannic wars are, not against their own nations, but against humans themselves. the fallacies humans have are about godlike power and immortality which will end in blood(war), "this is definite"... the ending the third stanza is how tangible and real the reality of no wars and truth really is
---the fourth stanza:
everyone wants immortality, everyone wants to be the greatest. but if "nobility, without persona, meets man" which means if highly authoritative figures talk to regular folks, you will find that every single person is the same and has the same needs and same fears( our ego is a veil). this is the a truth in the world that can create "infinity in the finite" which is an everlasting peace among people that are here for a short while(finite)
"A concrete fallacy" is an abstraction because we live in a world of fallacy but we think it is concrete.
--perhaps you should look to read through abstractions to offer me advice that will aid in my poetic future as opposed to limiting your mind to concrete things.

[spacecoaster]

I looked for the meaning in the poem but I think it fell short of what you are trying to say. Your explanation of what the poem means should be the poem itself. I like the abstract imaginary but there is not enough of an image created to understand your meaning. Overall you do create some good images and you use language well.

A concrete fallacy plagues the youth,     I like this start it is strong
forsaken bonds of brotherhood,              not sure who? all youth?
steers its way up the crimson slough.

Layers, veiling the absolute,
the uprooting of stability
threaten to grab helm,
man against man,
man against nature,     By mentioning all of these struggles I feel you add nothing
man against himself;
a timeless battle,
pitted against mountain and sea
sparring apparitions cloaked as warriors    I like these two lines they do say a lot
weilding naught, but dreams of immortality

drop the malicious tyranny
disguised as eden, my youth.
the fallacies of man end in in blood, this is definite
for the absolute is tangible                                   Unclear what you are referring to hear in this stance
and without need for veils

scribbled in history
there is a dream of recurrence
nobility, without persona, meets man                      I wish for more detail. where in history? What happened?              
an everlasting truce,
creating infinity in the finite, ensues
this, my youth,
the palpable truth

[ellajam]

Hi, J.C. I just want to point out that when a reader lets you know they don't understand a poem that's posted in a workshop they aren't asking for an explanation. They are just letting you know what worked and what didn't for them, it's up to you to edit to clarify or not.

Welcome to the Pigpen.

--thank you for your opinion. as much as you dislike abstractions, is how much i love them.
--This poem is about the fallacy that the world is teaching children is the right way(in this poem, i am going in opposition with this fallacy). such as racism, hatred, a fear of an authority, a fear of life in general.
the first stanza is basically "a bond of forsaken brotherhood" meaning the bond we have as humans is being forsaken, because of wars amongst other humans, as the "forsakeness"(abstraction) is riding along a shallow swampy river of blood "red slough" portraying blood spilled due to the forsaken bond...
--the second stanza begins by saying that the "uprooting of stability threatens to grab helm"...by this, i am offering light from the dark thoughts of this fallacy continuing endlessly by saying that to uproot the stablity(stability here meaning the state of fallacy that humans have been living in forever) threatens to take control of the "boat" going up the red slough. i am saying that the act of not living in the fallacy "threatens" to come into existence and change the fate of endless wars and bloodshed.
in the later lines, the words are portraying an image of battles humans have such as against nature, another human, and ourselves. it is a timeless battle because these battles have been obviously going since the beginning of time. the battle is pitted against mountain and sea because the fact that these battles have been going on for centuries and no victor has been declared...
how can one wield dreams of immortality? well speaking metaphorically, one can wield anything that he thinks will keep him alive during a battle, the only reason people wage wars is to be the greatest and immortalize themselves. wars are being fought by "apparitions cloaked as warriors" because aren't we all doomed to be apparitions in the end?
--the third stanza is showing how tyrannic wars are, not against their own nations, but against humans themselves. the fallacies humans have are about godlike power and immortality which will end in blood(war), "this is definite"... the ending the third stanza is how tangible and real the reality of no wars and truth really is
---the fourth stanza:
everyone wants immortality, everyone wants to be the greatest. but if "nobility, without persona, meets man" which means if highly authoritative figures talk to regular folks, you will find that every single person is the same and has the same needs and same fears( our ego is a veil). this is the a truth in the world that can create "infinity in the finite" which is an everlasting peace among people that are here for a short while(finite)
"A concrete fallacy" is an abstraction because we live in a world of fallacy but we think it is concrete.
--perhaps you should look to read through abstractions to offer me advice that will aid in my poetic future as opposed to limiting your mind to concrete things.

[milo]

A concrete fallacy plagues the youth,
forsaken bonds of brotherhood,
steers its way up the crimson slough.

Layers, veiling the absolute,
the uprooting of stability
threaten to grab helm,
man against man,
man against nature,
man against himself;
a timeless battle,
pitted against mountain and sea
sparring apparitions cloaked as warriors
weilding naught, but dreams of immortality

drop the malicious tyranny
disguised as eden, my youth.
the fallacies of man end in in blood, this is definite
for the absolute is tangible
and without need for veils

scribbled in history
there is a dream of recurrence
nobility, without persona, meets man
an everlasting truce,
creating infinity in the finite, ensues
this, my youth,
the palpable truth



*i understand the format is rough, please post on the context and evoking emotion more than the structure of my poem, this is not my finished product of format*

for me, this falls flat. It really is an endless list of nonsense that must mean something to you but won't to any of your readers.  Good poetry is built on the foundation of concrete details.  

In addition to the abstractions (and there are a lot) there is quite a bit of cliche with no real imagery or details for a reader to sink their teeth into. A good deal of it cannot even be parsed into English sentences -  " . . . there is a dream of recurrence nobility, without persona, meets man . . ."  What?

"the absolute is tangible" - what on earth could this possibly mean?

"layers, veiling the absolute" - layers of what?  Absolute what?  Do you mean absolution?

"threaten to grab helm" - layers are threatening to grab a hat?  Why would anyone care of unidentified layers grabbed a hat?

"palpable truth" - what is the difference between a palpable truth and an impalpable truth?

For the most part, I think it fails on many layers and none of them really grab my hat.

Welcome to the site.  Good Luck!

[J.C. Fontenot]

thank you all for the critiquing. i will add more explanations and concrete images in my poem although they may be lengthy, you will all see this poem again, reformed, on this site.