He visits gangs in the meadow - Edit 1

[Alexearth]

Edited version:

He visits gangs in the meadow.

From crumbling shelters
of bored youth,
the sigh of a certain train in the distance,
and shapes form on their closed eyelids.

In empty lots, They shout
and pound the earth,
They try to be heard.

Mischief under cold
summer lamp posts.
Cloud breaths rise-
alone again,
sickened in metal coffins.



Original:

The motor sighs in late quietude

Highway lights among
shadows

Under charcoal sky

and again the silence
a wing over the suburbs

Faces in abandoned cars

Enter the City
where the curtains close

//


He visits gangs in the meadow

From crumbling shelters
of bored youth
Sighs a certain train in the distance
& shapes form on their closed eyelids

Beneath a harvest
moon, They shout
and pound the earth
They try to be heard

Mischief under cold summer lampposts
Cloud breath rise
alone again
sicken in metal coffins

[CorneliusFerguson]

Hello there,
Some great aspects to this poem, however I feel they are too varied in their approach. Whenever I get into he poem it feels that the next line jolts me and it affects the continuity. This of course is a powerful tool all of its own, but I don't think that is the effect you are going for in this fluid modern setting. For example: "Faces in abandoned cars", while I sense it to be a deeply symbolic line, doesn't work where it is. I believe ".....a wing over the suburbs/Enter the City...." has a more constant flow without the interlude. This applies at a few points.
Next, in my opinion your use of the word "sigh" to describe both the noise of the motor and the train needs further thought, Sigh is a very powerful onomatopoeic phrase that in my mind conflicts with the images you are depicting. I would personally never associate it with the mechanical nature of combustion engines. Moreover it doesn't work as a contrast either and the irony (if intended) would need further development throughout.
In summation, you need to find a select number of directions in a poem and unify and expand on them, not just touch on several and jump between them.
That is my opinion anyway, take on board what you wish. Regardless keep up the good work. I look forward to reading more of your stuff.

[Erthona]

"Sighs a certain train in the distance" "sights"?

I don't understand what this is supposed say, I have no idea if it is referencing birds or hoodlums. I have never found stringing dependent clauses together an effective tool to set the scene. I'm all for brevity, but not at the cost of clarity.

Dale

[Alexearth]

Hello there,
Some great aspects to this poem, however I feel they are too varied in their approach. Whenever I get into he poem it feels that the next line jolts me and it affects the continuity. This of course is a powerful tool all of its own, but I don't think that is the effect you are going for in this fluid modern setting. For example: "Faces in abandoned cars", while I sense it to be a deeply symbolic line, doesn't work where it is. I believe ".....a wing over the suburbs/Enter the City...." has a more constant flow without the interlude. This applies at a few points.
Next, in my opinion your use of the word "sigh" to describe both the noise of the motor and the train needs further thought, Sigh is a very powerful onomatopoeic phrase that in my mind conflicts with the images you are depicting. I would personally never associate it with the mechanical nature of combustion engines. Moreover it doesn't work as a contrast either and the irony (if intended) would need further development throughout.
In summation, you need to find a select number of directions in a poem and unify and expand on them, not just touch on several and jump between them.
That is my opinion anyway, take on board what you wish. Regardless keep up the good work. I look forward to reading more of your stuff.

Thank you for your comment Cornelius Ferguson. You are making a good point for the continuity of the poem. As an atmosphere of a whole, I wanted to write something dark yet melancholic. "Sigh" here is used to represent the comfortable loneliness of the road at night in stanza 1, and also the loss of hope to escape from a certain state in stanza 2. Maybe the word "sigh" isn't appropriate for the noise of a motor, but where I was living before, hearing a train in the distance sort of sounded like it. But I you are right for needing to choose a unique direction for the poem. Thanks again


Alex

---

"Sighs a certain train in the distance" "sights"?

I don't understand what this is supposed say, I have no idea if it is referencing birds or hoodlums. I have never found stringing dependent clauses together an effective tool to set the scene. I'm all for brevity, but not at the cost of clarity.

Dale

Thank you for your comment Dale,
Yes this is about hoodlums, at least in the second stanza. It depicts their routine. With the line "Sighs a certain train in the distance" I tried writing a metaphor on how they are unable to escape their state. This "sigh" was also a recurring sound I heard many nights, inducing a certain nostalgia.
Can you explain what you mean by stringing dependent clauses together?


Alex

[bena]

Since the only time you use the gang reference is in the second part, I am with Alex about meadow. The wing over suburbs is a plane, more than likely, at least that's the way I read it.

The lack of punctuation is particularly annoying in such a rambling, obscure work. If you're going to write about vague concepts, you have to give readers a map or we'll never find our way out. You have extremely random capitalization and nothing else.

Be careful with using the same word more than once in a minimalistic poem (especially if it has two different meanings)---for example sighs as a verb, then more as an interjection (sighs( <,> the train)

Harvest moon is cliché.

sicken in metal coffins makes no sense no matter how I try to arrange my thoughts. Sick, in metal coffins? maybe. But certainly not sicken. Sickened, perhaps. Don't have a clue.

What Dale means is that these are not independent clauses. They can't stand alone as complete thought. They are linked to other clauses that are the same.


If this were longer with a bit more information it might work. Right now I'm thinking it may be an attempt to write a discordant piano piece without knowing what twelve tone rows are.

[Erthona]

Bena is correct. It is the difference between:

"Highway lights among
shadows
Under charcoal sky
and again the silence
a wing over the suburbs
Faces in abandoned cars
Enter the City
where the curtains close"

If written as sentences with the implied ending and beginning.

"Highway lights among shadows. Under charcoal sky and again the silence a wing over the suburbs. Enter the City where the curtains close."

Dale

[bena]

Dale you were nice in novice. Alot nicer than I could have been, and I really loved that. Where's your sack here??? I have bigger balls right now and I'm not sure they go with the tits. This is MILD critique. I know is not serious, but give some stronger advice. He may not know exactly what I mean, so don't just tell him I'm right...........................

Bah. Way to sick to hang in and be "gentle" but I love you guys and I'm off to fly a banana over the town since we don't have any good sniper towers. Or to the hospital. Dunno just yet.

[Erthona]

bena wrote:

Dale you were nice in novice. Alot (sic) nicer than I could have been, and I really loved that. Where's your sack here??? I have bigger balls right now and I'm not sure they go with the tits. This is MILD critique. I know is not serious, but give some stronger advice. He may not know exactly what I mean, so don't just tell him I'm right...........................

Well, he is a newbi and this is mild critique! I will accept blame for not being clear enough when I said you were right. I was referring to the following line by you:

"What Dale means is that these are not independent clauses. They can't stand alone as complete thought. They are linked to other clauses that are the same."

Being judicious does not in anyway shrivel the size of one's gonads.

I'm probably going to get modded for answering you, but I wanted to clear up any lack of clearness about what I meant.

Dale

[Alexearth]

Since the only time you use the gang reference is in the second part, I am with Alex about meadow. The wing over suburbs is a plane, more than likely, at least that's the way I read it.

The lack of punctuation is particularly annoying in such a rambling, obscure work. If you're going to write about vague concepts, you have to give readers a map or we'll never find our way out. You have extremely random capitalization and nothing else.

Be careful with using the same word more than once in a minimalistic poem (especially if it has two different meanings)---for example sighs as a verb, then more as an interjection (sighs( <,> the train)

Harvest moon is cliché.

sicken in metal coffins makes no sense no matter how I try to arrange my thoughts. Sick, in metal coffins? maybe. But certainly not sicken. Sickened, perhaps. Don't have a clue.

What Dale means is that these are not independent clauses. They can't stand alone as complete thought. They are linked to other clauses that are the same.


If this were longer with a bit more information it might work. Right now I'm thinking it may be an attempt to write a discordant piano piece without knowing what twelve tone rows are.

Thanks for your advice and opinion Bena. I was thinking of the first stanza as an ambient introduction, but yeah they have to be related, and I'll of course work on the punctuation.

[Alexearth]

bena wrote:

Dale you were nice in novice. Alot (sic) nicer than I could have been, and I really loved that. Where's your sack here??? I have bigger balls right now and I'm not sure they go with the tits. This is MILD critique. I know is not serious, but give some stronger advice. He may not know exactly what I mean, so don't just tell him I'm right...........................

Well, he is a newbi and this is mild critique! I will accept blame for not being clear enough when I said you were right. I was referring to the following line by you:

"What Dale means is that these are not independent clauses. They can't stand alone as complete thought. They are linked to other clauses that are the same."

Being judicious does not in anyway shrivel the size of one's gonads.

I'm probably going to get modded for answering you, but I wanted to clear up any lack of clearness about what I meant.

Dale

We need truthful and direct feedback! I think i'll slowly go to serious workshopping..

[bena]

I just want to say....there are phrases in this that are stunning. They could be a poem of their own right. Together it just seems a bit mish-mash and I wonder what it all means, that's all. If we are observing a scene, give us more detail so we are all with you and not looking at a Picaso painting pointing out -- I think that's the nose....know what I mean?


bena becomes melonius. (my name is mel btw if I type that sometime)

[Alexearth]

Thank you Mel, yes the poem is a description of a scene, and i want to mostly depict the atmosphere. I'll share an edit of it soon!

Alex

[Alexearth]

*Here's my first edit (I decided to use the first stanza as a poem of its own):


He visits gangs in the meadow.

From crumbling shelters
of bored youth,
the sigh of a certain train in the distance,
and shapes form on their closed eyelids.

In empty lots, They shout
and pound the earth,
They try to be heard.

Mischief under cold
summer lamp posts.
Cloud breaths rise;
alone again.
sickened in metal coffins.


* I'm not sure about the semi-colon after "rise". I wanted to link the breaths to people "alone again" but I don't know if it works here.

[bena]

OK this is much improved but still needs some work. Here's my take on the revision:

From crumbling shelters
of bored youth,
the sigh of a certain train in the distance,
and shapes form on their closed eyelids. <>

In empty lots, They shout <>
and pound the earth,
They try to be heard.

Mischief under cold
summer lamp posts.
Cloud breaths rise;
alone again.
sickened in metal coffins. <
Marked improvement!
PS you may want to put "edit 1" in title so that people will check back to see the improvements/offer other suggestions.


Cheers!

mel.

[Alexearth]

OK this is much improved but still needs some work. Here's my take on the revision:

From crumbling shelters
of bored youth,
the sigh of a certain train in the distance,
and shapes form on their closed eyelids. <>

In empty lots, They shout <>
and pound the earth,
They try to be heard.

Mischief under cold
summer lamp posts.
Cloud breaths rise;
alone again.
sickened in metal coffins. <
Marked improvement!
PS you may want to put "edit 1" in title so that people will check back to see the improvements/offer other suggestions.


Cheers!

mel.

Thanks Mel!

"Mischief under cold
summer lamp posts.
Cloud breaths rise;
alone again,
sickened in metal coffins. "

The "alone again" refers to the youth. I am having a hard time finding a good punctuation to say that "the youth is alone again, sickened in metal coffins" and at the same time, linking the cloud breaths to them, without changing or adding words...

[bena]

I'm thinking you need that youth in there. Way too many things that could be alone again...the cloud breaths, lamp posts....etc. Why not

Cloud breaths rise;
youth is alone again,
sickened in metal coffins.

If you have too many dangling modifiers with no sure path back to what they modify, you leave the readers flapping in the wind trying to grasp onto nothingness. And the coffins being plural is a bit confusing, do you mean one youth? Several youths?

..m

[Alexearth]

I'm thinking you need that youth in there. Way too many things that could be alone again...the cloud breaths, lamp posts....etc. Why not

Cloud breaths rise;
youth is alone again,
sickened in metal coffins.

If you have too many dangling modifiers with no sure path back to what they modify, you leave the readers flapping in the wind trying to grasp onto nothingness. And the coffins being plural is a bit confusing, do you mean one youth? Several youths?

..m

You're right. But I have to think about it because adding "youth" makes less pretty.. and coffins is in plural because when I say "youth" I consider it being the social group, the gangs with its members.

[KROD]

Edited version:

He visits gangs in the meadow.

From crumbling shelters
of bored youth,
the sigh of a certain train in the distance,
and shapes form on their closed eyelids.

In empty lots, They shout
and pound the earth,
They try to be heard.

Mischief under cold
summer lamp posts.
Cloud breaths rise-
alone again,
sickened in metal coffins.



Original:

The motor sighs in late quietude

Highway lights among
shadows

Under charcoal sky

and again the silence
a wing over the suburbs

Faces in abandoned cars

Enter the City
where the curtains close

//


He visits gangs in the meadow

From crumbling shelters
of bored youth
Sighs a certain train in the distance
& shapes form on their closed eyelids

Beneath a harvest
moon, They shout
and pound the earth
They try to be heard

Mischief under cold summer lampposts
Cloud breath rise
alone again
sicken in metal coffins

This captured my eye right away because of reference to gangs. The line "They try to be heard" was my favorite because some kids say they join gangs because no one cares or listens to them & also "from crumbling shelters" speaks to the poverty that many live in and turn to gangs as a way out ( not excusing it). I like the topic but I think, like me, you need better structure in your poem to help the reader sense and maybe internalize what it's about. I was confused by "sicken in metal coffins" My first thought was the morgue but didn't seem right.