Conundrum

[nb]

Hi!

The "fence" I refer to is the orthodox Jewish concept of "putting a fence around the Torah" to protect it as per the Talmudic dictum "The oral tradition is a protective fence for the Torah."

In the third stanza, click here for the Passover imagery ("seder", "bitter herbs" and "four cups").

The reference to "the House of Rimmon" is taken from II Kings 5:18. "Bowing down in the House of Rimmon" means (to quote Rabbi Joseph Hertz), "unwilling and/or perfunctory homage" or to, "pay lip-service to a principle; sacrifice one’s principles for the sake of conformity."

With reference to one of the great original Star Trek episodes: "For the World is Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky".


Once the fence inspired awe
now I run atop the posts.
I could very well fall
but at least I'm alive.
I can tell because the fenceposts prick my feet.

Others see green grass
but I see weeds;
hallowed ground for them,
hollow ground for me,
where my feet grow heavy on the old familiar paths.

(I had seder in the House of Rimmon,
awash in bitter herbs,
where hopes are stillborn
and dwindle into fantasies,
that four cups couldn't drown, but not for want of trying.)

I know the world is hollow
but I fear to touch the sky
lest it shatter
and my family be caught in the wreckage.
So on I run, trying to keep my balance, but at least my feet hurt.


Howzat?

nb

[ellajam]

Hi, I deleted your notes in my reply because I'd rather not read them yet, let the poem stand on it's own. There's a lot I like here. Here are some notes.

Once the fence inspired awe You may need some punctuation here.
now I run atop the posts.
I could very well fall
but at least I'm alive.
I can tell because the fenceposts prick my feet.
I think this start is really effective. I know the fence you speak of, I'm not sure whether or not I would need more explanation if I didn't. You'll find out.

Others see green grass
but I see weeds;
hallowed ground for them,
hollow ground for me,
where my feet grow heavy on the old familiar paths. I'd cut "where."

(I had seder in the House of Rimmon,
awash in bitter herbs,
where hopes are stillborn
and dwindle into fantasies,
that four cups couldn't drown, but not for want of trying.)
I like the above a lot for the rituals that often don't have the desired effect, but I'm not a fan of the first line or the parentheses. Possibly "seder" might be replaced with a more universal description and I don't know what the "House of Rimmon" is, if it's yours why not let me know that?


I know the world is hollow
but I fear to touch the sky
lest it shatter
and my family be caught in the wreckage.
So on I run, trying to keep my balance, but at least my feet hurt.
Again, I like this. I would reconsider "trying to keep" and aim for something more visual as you did at the beginning.


Howzat?

nb

Thanks for the read, I hope my notes help if you consider an edit.
Again, welcome.

[ChristopherSea]

NB, Zitsgoood, I love the original StarTrek reference and that royal hottie was a fine piece of alien…you know.

Your poem is intriguing, especially in the light of the other material you reference. I don’t think anyone would pick up on those Jewish themes and appreciate the depth of your extended metaphor without them until they hit 'seder' in stanza three (thanks for the notes).

Some of the punctuation seems off for me, specifically: you need a comma after awe, I would put one after fall, a coma or semicolon might serve you better after alive (the lines are intimately connected), a comma after weeds might be more apropos than the semicolon.

I don’t feel that stanza three comes off as parenthetical thought, therefore the parenthesis is not needed.

I could put two more commas in the closing stanza after hollow and sky. One thing I noticed with the close was what felt like some filler to maintain that five line stanza standard you set for the poem.

Also, running seems to contradict the carefulness taken not to break the thin walled sphere. Perhaps, some more brevity and soft-shoe could be considered for a stronger ending. For example, (not strict re-write): ...hollow, but I fear to touch the fragile sky and I pace softly to keep my balance...

You get the drift; see what you think. Good luck with your next edit and welcome to the site./Chris

[Erthona]

NB,

Yeah, I would never get this without the explanation. I know a fair amount about the Bible, and have read a number of the ancillary text from Rabbis, but I am not Jewish and so something that I think is closely related to the Jewish faith (although it makes perfect sense) would not be grasp by many outside of Judaism. I think this could be handled by footnotes, which are often used in poetry for the more obscure allusions. I agree with Chris that what you have in parenthesis is not really parenthetical. I'm not sure why you have the extended line in the fifth line.

My main problem is there is nothing in the poem that connects the first paragraph to the idea of the oral tradition being a protection for the Torah. I think maybe even people who were Jewish might have difficulty picking that out. It's a long way to go from fence in ground to protection of Torah. Fence can mean a lot of things, how is the reader suppose to know what you are talking about. You allude to Passover, but how does that connect to the "Fence"? It's a nice idea, but I don't think you pull it off.

Shalom, and welcome to the site,

Dale

[Todd]

Yeah, if you have to explain it the poem isn't doing its job. One simple fix may be to rename the title: "Torah"

[nb]

Hi!

Thank you all for your notes & comments. I will definitely work on a rewrite/edit.

"Conundrum" gives voice (or tries to) to a spritual conundrum that I have been dealing with for about a year now. An orthodox Jew, I am finding myself increasingly disenchanted with much of the spin that our sages have put on our core beliefs ("Once the fence inspired awe...") and, at the same time, very strongly drawn to our Samaritan brothers (just calling the 800 or so Samaritans our "brothers" would get me a quizzical look if not a rebuke from most orthodox rabbis) & their version of our faith. I feel conflicted, torn, confused, etc. I tried to put some of that into "Conundrum." Passover was last month. While we o'dox Jews were playing at Passover, the Samaritans were really doing it.

Yeah, if you have to explain it the poem isn't doing its job.

You're right, of course, but...I figured that the spiritual dilemmas of an orthodox Jew might be so far outside the familiar for most folks here at the Pig Pen that I had to explain at least a little bit.

Anyhoo...

Thanks again for the comments, much food-for-thought for a revision.

nb