gun laws

[billy]

it may be different in the states but in most countries it's a valid form of id.

and if criminals can fake id for credit card use how hard to buy a gun ?

[altezon]

... and if criminals can fake id for credit card use how hard to buy a gun ?

Well, you can get a credit card without having to present the physical ID. And you can use the credit card with no ID at all.

[billy]

this is from 2001 before computer printing got really good lmao.

Fake IDs are "getting so good now that we actually have to use laboratory equipment to detect them," says Dave Myers of Florida's Division of Alcoholic Beverages and Tobacco. "The average printer you can buy from Wal-Mart creates a very good quality license."

During four spring-break weeks this year, Myers and his agents staked out bars, restaurants and nightclubs in two Florida beach towns, Panama City and Daytona Beach. Myers says police looked for

IDs with flawed holograms and incorrect letter and number codes that are supposed to be known only by police and a state's motor vehicles department.

They arrested about 350 teenagers for carrying fake IDs and 1,200 for underage drinking and confiscated 10,000 bogus IDs. That's an indication, Myers says, of the enormous popularity of counterfeit licenses among high school and college students. If you extrapolate the Panama City and Daytona Beach figures, he says, "you're talking millions and millions" of fake IDs around the country.

source:

[altezon]

As I mentioned earlier, the principal ID in the US is either an actual state driver's license or a state-issued ID based on the same format. Since police in one state can check the records of another state, as can the NICS, simply forging an ID is no good unless you're a teenager looking to fool a bartender. I suppose you could forge the ID of an actual license holder if you knew the correct data to put in. These printers will forge a plastic card with the hologram?

EDIT: Actually, I'm not sure if the NICS checks for an actual license the way the police do, or if if just looks to see if a name has been flagged as "prohibited".

[billy]

you get the card with holos on them
in the uk there are certain people who give your details to and they give you a genuine licence.
i live in the phil. within three months of being here i had a genuine licence, no test, no check up as such.
i could have said i was someone else. anyone else. birth certs are easy to get hold of. every cemetery has a list of people who won't tell. from the birth cert you can get almost any id you need or want.

just look at the ten peops up on spying charges lol. all have driving licenses and papers to say they're usa citizen. money will get you anything, it matters not that you could be a criminal.

i was offered a genuine gun license here signed by a major in the police force for 30,000 pesos. 45 pesos to the dollar. i know here isn't like the usa but i'm pretty sure within a short period of timein the usa i could have the proper id to withstand a check that would allow me to walk out with a supposedly legal gun if i so desired.

in the uk its just as easy to forge a license or passport of someone who doesn't have one. or get one in that persons name. using fake id that passes police checks isn't anywhere near as hard as people think. anywhere that allows the person to walk out of the shop with good bought under a bogus name is asking for trouble. the gun should be delivered to the address or better yet be picked up at a police station a week after purchase and a finger print check to show you're who you say you are..

[altezon]

Sounds refreshing. But you have to admit that possible doesn't mean easy, especially in the US.

[billy]

true.
yet from experience i'd say whatever the system the usa has
the criminal element has many ways to circumvent it
it's the same the world over.

[altezon]

it's the same the world over.

Aha !!!

[billy]

the sad thing is, criminals will always have access to guns where ever they live
and despite what any law or gov says, that fact will never change.

[altezon]

There's nothing intrinsically wrong with guns. How shall a person protect himself? swordplay? kung fu? pleading for mercy?

[billy]

i agree. i think responsible people in society
should have the right to at least keep one at home.
p[ossibly on the person as well though i'm not certain about it

but for that to happen we (society) need to sort out who is allowed and who isn't, anyone who isn't allowed a gun, who has one should get a life sentence. anyone who kills with one should get a death sentence. anyone who sells one illegally gets a death sentence. same with ammunition. if someone lets their license expire fine them 10000 dollars and bar them from having a gun in future.

being able to own a gun for self defense and hunting should be a right, but only for those who have ability to understand what that right entails. that you cant just kill animals willy nilly when you wish. and that you can't buy and sell guns unless licensed.

the 2nd amendment does not give anyone the right to sell arms as far as i know.

[altezon]

Too fookin many rules. Do what ya gotta do.

[billy]

should anarchy be the order of the day?
if so let kill all the criminals.

[altezon]

Laws are obviously useful. But too many laws regulating the mundane details of people's lives are bad, I think. I know you're not seriously suggesting that if anarchy became prevalent that "we" should kill all the "criminals"? Terms seem a bit vague here.

[billy]

i'm saying that if anarchy prevailed, criminals would probably be beaten to death in the street where they were caught. the strongest of best armed would create their own laws and basically nothing would change but the severity of breaking some warlords laws. the anarchists laws are often much more ruthless than normal laws.

we only have to look at uganda when amin was in power, or Rwanda where one of the rules was to chop the hands off anyone who wasn't with the rebels and the to kill anyone who was a nun, priest or missionary.

then we have a different kind of anarchy like we had in cambodia. there the law said kill all the teachers, burn all the books and make people who use industry or science to make a living work in the fields or die. in all these anarchistic regimes, criminals were summarily put to death, usually after being tortured. most of the criminals by the way hadn't committed any crime more serious than not agreeing with those in power.

[altezon]

Point taken.