a point arose about this is not poetry

[milo]

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@milo it is contradictory that you say that and this:"Everything I write is what I think, what is the point qualifying what should be obvious?" unless im taking it out of context, how "separate" can your own ideas be. I guess by separate you mean, to not fret when someone calls your poem shit.

I don't even see the word separate in that text you quote. That text refers to the fact that everything I say comes from me, my unique vantage point - IOW, even though I try to call the pope and consult with Jesus Christ everytime i express something, both are too busy so it comes from me. How does this in any way contradict anything else i have ever said?

people learn how to do things right either by observation or someone telling them how. telling someone their poem is shit doesnt teach them HOW to do things right, all it does is tell them that what they're doing is wrong. there is a weak correlation. even if you think out of all the possibilities that telling someone their poem is shit will lead to them having an epiphany, and then being motivated to do better, you can still learn how to do things right without anyone ever telling you your work is shit.

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"I don't expect my clothes or my hair to be able to go and mingle"

can we agree that language, clothing and our appearance are all sign systems. in that sense then, poetry is no more "alive" no more separate or independent than clothing or our hair, which both convey meaning to others/has ability to provoke emotion/thought

nope. You stay with your clothing and hair to help defend them from others. Writing /needs/ to stand on its own, it is one of the first and most difficult lessons for aspiring writers to learn.

Before aspiring writers can ever learn what to improve or how to improve, they need to learn that they need to improve. This is a painful process that most never get to.

I can tell you because I have been through the process and because I have seen over and over the cycle of denial that aspiring writers absolutely need to get through this. I am guessing your time hasn't come yet.