What the Storm Taught Us (Revision 4)

[Todd]

Hi Geoff,

Of course I don't mind you continuing to come back. Quite a few of my poems go through forty or more revisions so feedback like yours is very helpful. I'd like to explain why I made certain choices (not to defend them but to explain what I'm trying to do):

sail split/complete sentence: Yeah, I have two fragments one here and one in another place I'll see if there's a way to smooth this out some.

repetition of slept: I tried changing this up some, the problem I'm having is it isn't sounding right to my ear when I pull out either instance (I'm a play piano by ear sort of writer). Which suggests, to me that if I do make a change it will be bigger than a simple cut. I had the repetion in there to suggest that their incredulous. I'll see if anything better comes to me.

next: If I make the change it would have to be something more. I'm trying to avoid writing too much here, but I'll see what I can do. I was going for something unnatural like maybe he caused time itself to halt for a moment. He'd upset the natural order to such an extent that it was looking for permission to proceed again---hmm maybe something like that.

ending: I get what you're saying about echo. I will probably mess with the punctuation as you suggest. This will just take some more thought to decide if I see something I like better.

Thanks again.

Best,

Todd

---

Hi tectak,



PUNCTUATE after "still" or I shall take cyanide!

Comic Gold!

A lot to think about. Let me get back to you on your comments. I may need to walk away from this for a few weeks before continuing though to get the proper perspective.

Oh, and revision is about going mad overnight...so you're probably right.

Thanks again,

Todd

Changes Rev 3

Title change
Massive changes (too many to mention): Philatone, tectak, and an offsite friend gave extensive feedback.

[b]Revision 3

The sky—like the terror of children
left alone—pressed down.the fundamental error is still here, todd. I can see it,why can't you. Thd idea is too good to spoil or to usurp. The terror of children left alone cannot press down. Over to you
Our hands knotted
with the ropes, abraded
into palsied claws callused as the words
on my tongue,
as the salt from my heart. again,same point. What is callused salt?
Fishermen caught
by this man of words,
who slept as the mast splintered,
and sail split.not a sentence! Fishermen WERE caught....


Our throats raw from keening
prayers too inarticulate, too feral,
as he slept"our throats made raw" or "our throats were raw"

and woke to the spray"then woke" not "and". It is not easy to sleep AND wake at the same time.
of our accusations, groggyafter groggy you cannot fail to pause. How long do you want? A comma is a 1 count, a semi-colon 2, a colon 3 and a full stop 4. The length of the "count" is dermined by the tempo of the piece. Sorry about the egg sucking but I don't know where I am with you as you give no consistent clues of your understanding. Forgive me.
as if pulled from a conversation.

He spoke, and starlight pierced the clouds
in a thousand quick thrusts.Is a cliché a cliché if one has to ask if it is a cliché?
The waves receded
like a whisper.
The moment coiled upon itself: a tense serpent
uncertain what to do next.

He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness
to hide within the storm.
Still don't get this so it must be me
So still only the echo remainedPUNCTUATE after "still" or I shall take cyanide!
and we could not bear it.Unrelated "it". What couldn't you bare? The "still", the "echo" or both? Very poor ending, todd. You are MUCH better than this.
The ending appears to be a frustration. We could not bear "it", so what happened next?
~~~
I think you went mad overnight! This is truly worth the effor of workshopping and that is what this site is for. The nearer you get to the speed of light the harder it gets to reach it.
Best,
Tectak "buzz" lightyear

Changes Rev.2

Addressed the fishermen line: Mark, Philatone
Dealt with one of the word repetitions: Philatone
Dealt with the smooth path line: Philatone
Dropped "the" before waves: Philatone

Revision 2

The sky was like the terror of children
left alone.
Our hands knotted
into the ropes--palsied claws
callused as the words
on my tongue,
as the salt from my heart.

We fishermen, caught
by this man of words—
who slept as the mast splintered,
and sail split.
As our pleas turned to wails,
he slept

to wake to the spray
of our accusations, groggy
as if pulled from a conversation.

He spoke
and starlight pierced the clouds
in a thousand knife thrusts--
waves receding
like a whisper. So still

I almost stepped from the boat.

So still

only the echo remained,
and we could not bear it.
What is a leper, or a blind man,
or the raising of the dead compared
to a voice that can make
the sea submit.
He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we only longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness,
to hide within the storm.

~~~

Changes:

There were some broader ideas that I need to continue thinking about. There were though some areas that I could address immediately.

L3: Decided to cut “were”

L7: Opened the line with “as” (inspired by tectak)

S2: Decided to sacrifice the carpenter reference to help pacing and adopt some suggested sonic shifts. Also went with less lines to increase the pacing by eliminating some line break pauses (Philatone) Made some changes to the sail part (tectak)

Removed train-of thought (Philatone)

Removed the question marks and tried to smooth out the phrasing (consensus)



Revised

The sky was like the terror of children
left alone.
Our hands knotted
into the ropes--palsied claws
callused as the words
on my tongue,
as the salt from my heart.
Fishermen, who cast the nets
had become the catch

of this man of words—
who slept as the mast splintered,
and sail split.
As our pleas turned to wails,
he slept

to wake to the spray
of our accusations, groggy
as if pulled from a conversation.

At a word,
the tempest became
a smooth path. So still

I almost stepped from the boat.

So still

only the echo remained,
and we could not bear it.
What is a leper, or a blind man,
or the raising of the dead compared
to a voice that can make
the sea submit.
He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we only longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness,
to hide within the storm.

~~~

Original

The sky was like the terror of children
left alone.
Our hands were knotted
into the ropes--palsied claws
callused as the words
on my tongue,
the salt from my heart.
Fishermen, who cast the nets
had become the catch

of this man of words
who brought us here.
This man at home with wood,
who slept while it buckled,
as the mast splintered,
the sail snapped,
as our pleas turned
to wails, he slept

to wake to the spray
of our accusations, groggy
as if pulled from a conversation,
losing his train-of-thought.

At a word,
the tempest became
a smooth path. So still

I almost stepped from the boat.

So still

only the echo remained,
and we could not bear it.
To command the wind
What is a leper? Or a blind man?
Or the raising of the dead? Compared
to a sea that recognizes a voice.
He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we only longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness,
to hide within the storm.

[tectak]

Changes Rev 3

Title change
Massive changes (too many to mention): Philatone, tectak, and an offsite friend gave extensive feedback.

[b]Revision 3

The sky—like the terror of children
left alone—pressed down.the fundamental error is still here, todd. I can see it,why can't you. Thd idea is too good to spoil or to usurp. The terror of children left alone cannot press down. Over to you
Our hands knotted
with the ropes, abraded
into palsied claws callused as the words
on my tongue,
as the salt from my heart. again,same point. What is callused salt?
Fishermen caught
by this man of words,
who slept as the mast splintered,
and sail split.not a sentence! Fishermen WERE caught....


Our throats raw from keening
0prayers too inarticulate, too feral,
as he slept"our throats made raw" or "our throats were raw"

and woke to the spray"then woke" not "and". It is not easy to sleep AND wake at the same time.
of our accusations, groggyafter groggy you cannot fail to pause. How long do you want? A comma is a 1 count, a semi-colon 2, a colon 3 and a full stop 4. The length of the "count" is dermined by the tempo of the piece. Sorry about the egg sucking but I don't know where I am with you as you give no consistent clues of your understanding. Forgive me.
as if pulled from a conversation.

He spoke, and starlight pierced the clouds
in a thousand quick thrusts.Is a cliché a cliché if one has to ask if it is a cliché?
The waves receded
like a whisper.
The moment coiled upon itself: a tense serpent
uncertain what to do next.
?
He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness
to hide within the storm.
Still don't get this so it must be me
So still only the echo remainedPUNCTUATE after "still" or I shall take cyanide!
and we could not bear it.Unrelated "it". What couldn't you bare? The "still", the "echo" or both? Very poor ending, todd. You are MUCH better than this.
The ending appears to be a frustration. We could not bear "it", so what happened next?
~~~
I think you went mad overnight! This is truly worth the effor of workshopping and that is what this site is for. The nearer you get to the speed of light the harder it gets to reach it.
Best,
Tectak "buzz" lightyear (Oh, and it should be "tensed" serpent.)

Changes Rev.2

Addressed the fishermen line: Mark, Philatone
Dealt with one of the word repetitions: Philatone
Dealt with the smooth path line: Philatone
Dropped "the" before waves: Philatone

Revision 2

The sky was like the terror of children
left alone.
Our hands knotted
into the ropes--palsied claws
callused as the words
on my tongue,
as the salt from my heart.

We fishermen, caught
by this man of words—
who slept as the mast splintered,
and sail split.
As our pleas turned to wails,
he slept

to wake to the spray
of our accusations, groggy
as if pulled from a conversation.

He spoke
and starlight pierced the clouds
in a thousand knife thrusts--
waves receding
like a whisper. So still

I almost stepped from the boat.

So still

only the echo remained,
and we could not bear it.
What is a leper, or a blind man,
or the raising of the dead compared
to a voice that can make
the sea submit.
He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we only longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness,
to hide within the storm.

~~~

Changes:

There were some broader ideas that I need to continue thinking about. There were though some areas that I could address immediately.

L3: Decided to cut “were”

L7: Opened the line with “as” (inspired by tectak)

S2: Decided to sacrifice the carpenter reference to help pacing and adopt some suggested sonic shifts. Also went with less lines to increase the pacing by eliminating some line break pauses (Philatone) Made some changes to the sail part (tectak)

Removed train-of thought (Philatone)

Removed the question marks and tried to smooth out the phrasing (consensus)



Revised

The sky was like the terror of children
left alone.
Our hands knotted
into the ropes--palsied claws
callused as the words
on my tongue,
as the salt from my heart.
Fishermen, who cast the nets
had become the catch

of this man of words—
who slept as the mast splintered,
and sail split.
As our pleas turned to wails,
he slept

to wake to the spray
of our accusations, groggy
as if pulled from a conversation.

At a word,
the tempest became
a smooth path. So still

I almost stepped from the boat.

So still

only the echo remained,
and we could not bear it.
What is a leper, or a blind man,
or the raising of the dead compared
to a voice that can make
the sea submit.
He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we only longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness,
to hide within the storm.

~~~

Original

The sky was like the terror of children
left alone.
Our hands were knotted
into the ropes--palsied claws
callused as the words
on my tongue,
the salt from my heart.
Fishermen, who cast the nets
had become the catch

of this man of words
who brought us here.
This man at home with wood,
who slept while it buckled,
as the mast splintered,
the sail snapped,
as our pleas turned
to wails, he slept

to wake to the spray
of our accusations, groggy
as if pulled from a conversation,
losing his train-of-thought.

At a word,
the tempest became
a smooth path. So still

I almost stepped from the boat.

So still

only the echo remained,
and we could not bear it.
To command the wind
What is a leper? Or a blind man?
Or the raising of the dead? Compared
to a sea that recognizes a voice.
He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we only longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness,
to hide within the storm.

[tectak]

Hi Jiminy (Popeye),

Thank you for your kind words. I'm glad the beginning and ending worked for you. Though you self-identify as a novice, it in no way limits the helpfulness of the feedback. In some ways, we're all novices. There's a nearly endless amount of information to learn and we're all putting it together as best as we can. Thanks again.

Best,

Todd

---

Hi Philatone,

I appreciate your comments and close read. I will absolutely consider them as I sit down to rewrite. Let me try to address some of the points you've raised:

left alone: It's probably a style bias of mine that pushes away from single word lines. I do agree with you that the break on left works very well also. I'll give it some thought to see if the change would enhance the poem. Thanks for pointing it out.

Fisherman part tense change: Those lines originally had another tense. So, I'll play around with it a bit and see if anything else sticks.

of words/the word: I see where you're going. It may be too early in the narrative for the speaker to fully make that connection, but it can be debated. The change does have a nice John 1 tie-in that could be exploited though, so I'll consider it.

immediacy slept lines: Good point. I think increasing the pace in some way might serve well. I'll work with it.

Train-of-thought: That needs to go. Unless it's a caravan, train is too modern. Now, I can't see it any other way. Thanks for the callout. It should be any easy fix.

Question marks: You are probably right let me look at it more.

Thanks for all your comments Geoff. They were most helpful.

Best,

Todd

---

Hi Tectak,

I very much appreciate the read and comments. Let me try to address some of them:

sky/terror of children: Hmm, I don't really see this as unmatched. It's also debatable whether something is effective I'll grant you that. But, I think we have the right with a simile to compare two unlike things. Now, If I look at the effectiveness question the lines originally read(written here with no concern for line breaks): The sky was dark like the terror of children left alone. I'm not sure if that was better the terror was than linking back to a type of darkness. As it's a primal fear, I sort of liked it. What I didn't like was the opening part of the phrase: The sky was dark. It just seemed pedestrian to me or overused. I thought if I used the exposition of storm in the title and than just linked the terror to the sky I could get a tighter image. It's posible something was sacrificed for that condensing though. Those were my thoughts on it. I'll consider the point you raise.

salt from my heart/accidental linkage: No, this was deliberate. I was trying to play back on the idea of callused. Maybe I should include an "as" before the salt to make the link more deliberate. It could be too choppy. Again, I'll add it to the list.

Sail snapped: Great call out in my desire for sonics I've been imprecise. It would be better to say the mast snapped or as you say the sail tears or some such. This will be altered definitely in the revision. Thanks for the catch.

Strophe break after sleep: It's there to give a beat of tension for the narrative. It is to show the passage from one narrative element to another.

Question marks/ recognize vs obey/comparing incomparables: You make some good points. Obey or some variation would probably be a much better word. I'll look into it. The question marks will probably not survive the next edit (thanks). I agree that this is comparing things that are incomparable. I chose that (again whether it's effective or not is debatable) because it seemed true to the narrative and the character given that the narrator is coming to grips with things beyond what they're able to handle.

The ending lacking sense: I get what you're saying. I really do. One of my projects, is a rewriting (some would say a heretical) rewriting of the biblical gospel stories as a series of connected poems (just to try it no real agenda in it). One of the fascinating things you see in these on the sea miracle stories is that they often don't have the expected reaction.

Though, I'm only using this one story I allude to two other stories in this poem (walking on the water obvious) and in the ending line I blend the terror they felt when they considered who was in the boat with them and the miracle of the great catch of fish. One interesting part to that one is that the speaker peter sees the fish filling the net and falls to his knees asking his lord to depart because he was a sinful man. There is an ongoing theme in stories like this or recognizing the sacred and holy and withdrawing from it as if burned. So, that's what I was going for at least.

Again, thanks for walking through the piece and commenting where you did. I will definitely make some changes based on your feedback. Much Appreciated.

Best,

Todd

Hi todd, similes. Similes DO compare "unlike" things......but this is achieved by relating the relevant characteristics to a commonality between the parts. So:
The sky was like fire. (As it was red)
Her breath was perfume. (As it smelt wonderful)
Ice sparkled like diamonds (like diamonds sparkle)

All above compare unlike things. Now:
The sky was like terror. Huh? Which characteristic of "the sky" can be commoned to a characteristic of "terror"?
What does terror look like, what colour us it, what does the sky smell like or sound like? Ok. The sky was frightening, like the terror of children left alone (was frightening). Bingo!
Pedantic,I know.
Best,
Tectak

[Todd]

I think people can make the leap. I see what you're saying, but I don't think I'm going to go that way. I have a different view on that point. That said, I'm letting it sit for a couple weeks and I'll see what I think then.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts

[tectak]

I think people can make the leap. I see what you're saying, but I don't think I'm going to go that way. I have a different view on that point. That said, I'm letting it sit for a couple weeks and I'll see what I think then.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts

No worries, Todd. It really is only a small issue. That readers can "make the leap" is a given......most don't look before they leap!
Best,
Tectak

[billy]

Changes Rev 3
Revision 3

The sky—like the terror of children
left alone—pressed down.
Our hands knotted
with the ropes, abraded
into palsied claws callused as the words callused feels at odds with abraded above
on my tongue,
as the salt from my heart.
Fishermen caught
by this man of words,
who slept as the mast splintered, these 2 lines don't seem to back up the 2 above it
and sail split.

the enjambment feels off in places for me, [on my tongue][left alone—pressed down.]

Our throats raw from keening
prayers too inarticulate, too feral,
as he slept does the repetition of him sleeping add anything?

and woke to the spray
of our accusations, groggy
as if pulled from a conversation. here again a contradiction of above where you say he slept as your throats keened

He spoke, and starlight pierced the clouds
in a thousand quick thrusts.
The waves receded
like a whisper.
The moment coiled upon itself: a tense serpent
uncertain what to do next. no nits with this stanza.

He that spoke light
had returned light to us,
and we longed to throw ourselves
into the darkness
to hide within the storm.

So still only the echo remained
and we could not bear it.

~~~

i get religious undertones mixed with Cap'n Ahab.
while the piece has a sinister quality i think it goes just that bit to far to be poetical. does that make any sense.

Our hands knotted
with the ropes, abraded
into palsied claws callused as the words
on my tongue,
as the salt from my heart.

i understand the above, but the double simile feels forced. for me
that said i think it a strong piece of poetry. i see it will be left before another edit and i think you're right. any more at this point and you may lose the centre of what you're trying to get across.
for all my suggestions it's better than i could write. and i do like the piece.
i think one of the problems you'll have with feedback is that it can be read in many ways, and everyone is going to see how it can be changed for the better for them. (something which is a good thing i think) it's one of those poems that will always be perfect for some and never for others.

probably because of the dynamics you have going on, everything works yet each part feels contradictory to the part next to it.

thanks for a really interesting read and my apologies for missing it first time round, jmo

[Todd]

Thank you for the comments Billy. I'll consider everything when I revise.

Much Appreciated.

Best,

Todd