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are the righteous to flaunt all the joy that they've got
while an evil man hides in his shame for his crimes?
with his head hung, embarrassed of all his high times
sent to whimper in Hell where the fires are so hot
should a sinner be put in this difficult spot?
and why shouldn't he live in a heaven sublime,
throw his cares to the breeze and his life to the rhyme
for his sins are so cold and his torment's to rot
he would rather have rain to come sweep him away
than to creep through his freedom in tact
as he drowns in the choices he's clung too, he'll say,
'I've no lust for your treasures, in fact,
but the feelings that rushed through my heart in the fray
and the wonderful lure of the act.'
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I am wholly unqualified to comment on whether or not you've nailed the sonnet form.
However, I enjoyed your choice of topic and the way you set about discoursing on it. 
PS. If you can, try your hand at giving some of the others a bit of feedback. If you already have, thanks, can you do some more?
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(09-24-2011, 11:59 AM)AvariciousApathist Wrote: are the righteous to flaunt all the joy that they've got
while an evil man hides in his shame for his crimes?
with his head hung, embarrassed of all his high times
sent to whimper in Hell where the fires are so hot
should a sinner be put in this difficult spot?
and why shouldn't he live in a heaven sublime,
throw his cares to the breeze and his life to the rhyme
for his sins are so cold and his torment's to rot
he would rather have rain to come sweep him away
than to creep through his freedom in tact
as he drowns in the choices he's clung too, he'll say,
'I've no lust for your treasures, in fact,
but the feelings that rushed through my heart in the fray
and the wonderful lure of the act.' to me it feel like the meter could do with some work,
in some places it's -/ = da dum
in others it's /- dum da
as well as a couple of other types.
the rhyme feel okay,
i think someone with a bit more craft on form could best help you on this one AA
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When I've written a sonnet I have moved heaven and earth to maintain exactly five unstressed and five stressed beats per line....but, you haven't done this. Is that because there is lee-way in a modern sonnet not to do so?
I don't suppose it matters if you deviate slightly, but (take) "I've no lust for your treasures, in fact/but the feelings that rushed through my heart in the fray" there is a huge discrepancy there...the first line is too short, and the second line too long.
It this wasn't a declared sonnet, then who cares.
Rhyme seems fine, though....I can't always remember what the pattern should be, but that looks okay to me abba, abba, cdcdcd
Your title was very inviting, and the poem itself was a cheeky look at an alternative to the standard 'rot in hell' for sinners - so I did enjoy the read.
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It's supposed to be anapestic tetrameter (first part) and trimeter (second part) I don't even know if you're supposed to write a sonnet in this meter, but I just wanted to try it.
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it was declared a sonnet in the title granny 
i think you can change the meter is such a way. (usually the first line or so) but the mechanics of it are beyond my weak grasp
i'm not sure the 2nd line is anap tet. if you wait for leanne, we'll find out what's what
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Then wait I shall
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Mark, I've not a nit to pick with the meter -- some sonnet nazis will tell you that it must be iambic pentameter, but Petrarch didn't use that meter and neither have plenty of other poets, it's just that some people assume that the most usual way is the only way possible and won't budge from that!
The second line? "while an E/vil man HIDES/ in his SHAME/ for his CRIMES" -- perfect anapaestic tetrameter. I also like your sestet, which not only gives you a volta in thought, but also changes the entire feel of the poem to almost a ballad, with the alternating foot lengths. I think it's an excellent sonnet in that it fulfills every requirement of the form. It always impresses me more when someone actually gets the essence of the form and can work out exactly what to change and why.
It could be worse
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Leanne,
I was kinda worried about this. After I posted this I began to see a lot of stuff on Wkipedia saying that sonnets had to be in iambic pentameter (at least Spenserian) and I was like, when Leanne gets back she is gonna cook my goose. Needless to say, I'm relieved and was smiling big while reading your take on this one.
Thanks for taking time to check this poem out.
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ssshhh... it's not Spenserian though, it's Petrarchan... and since Petrarch was Italian, why would we insist his style of sonnet be written in an English meter?
Although I don't think he used anapaests either... but that's probably just because he didn't think of them
It could be worse
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Oh, okay 
AA,
The best Sonnets do not rely on filler-words for the sake of maintaining meter. Anyone actually crafting poems understands sonnets are not spur of the moment pieces to be cooked up like a microwaveable snack. Poets fail, at any form when all they see is rhyme and meter. Deeper analysis will prove it takes something other than perfunctory practice to create something worthwhile.
As an example, if you wanted to make something of this piece you might first go through and take out every word that adds nothing to the meaning. Extraneous words such as “the" or "an” as well as pronouns that appear redundant, such as “his” in several of your lines. That alone will completely change the scansion of your piece. Even so, after this apply Samuel Taylor Coleridge’s lesson: “Poetry: The best words in the best order;” go through and replace ineffective or weak groups of words with stronger, more effective ones that express a particular thought more clearly if not more simply.
Do these first and you will begin to understand the form is more complex than most poets imagine.
Sid
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Hi Sid,
I realize that this is a very elementary poem to someone with your experience (and frankly, even to mine), but it was and is a learning tool. Reading your post was like standing naked in front of the class at first, but everything you said rang true. So, I will definitely try your advice although i forsee basically an entire rewrite 
Thanks for the feeback and tutorial. I am inching along through the self-education process and these words of experience are certainly appreciated
(09-29-2011, 05:32 AM)AvariciousApathist Wrote: Hi Sid,
I realize that this is a very elementary poem to someone with your experience (and frankly, even to mine), but it was and is a learning tool. Reading your post was like standing naked in front of the class at first, but everything you said rang true. So, I will definitely try your advice although i forsee basically an entire rewrite
Thanks for the feeback and tutorial. I am inching along through the self-education process and these words of experience are certainly appreciated
I hope none of my words came across as abrasive in any way. If they ever do, it may be it’s because I am averse to using smilies and lols in my critiques. And the last thing I want to come across as is condescending because, as you say, it is all indeed a learning experience--for all of us. I simply prefer to put my opinion forth honestly. Trust me, I and many of your fellow writers share similar hesitant feelings no matter the level at which we may find ourselves at present—at least we all should, because none of us will be announcing anytime soon we have learned everything and require no further growth. Personally, I find myself attempting to polish pieces just a little more and setting a higher standard for myself, because of certain writers I look up to now--Translation: I am not quite as confident as I was not so long ago. You have the right to consider what you want of anyone's critique and reject what you disagree with. I do not become offended if you have a point to argue either. And if you feel as though you’re naked before a class, trust that you are part of a larger club. Consider it a sign of growth, even as you give yourself a little pat on the back for being brave enough to call attention to your writing. But don’t let anyone stop you from continuing to write.
Sid
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I am grateful for all you've given me to think on and was never offended. I'll get back around to this before it's all said and done. Thanks again, Sid.
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