Posts: 2,602
Threads: 303
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No John, or David, Pete or Mat will bring Mohammed down.
A call, a cry, a father’s name; a million heads turn round.
Though saints infest the west the east protects its sneaking thief;
steals thinking sons from thoughtful life,
named in good faith to limit strife...
all synonyms for grief.
A century, millennium; time all but bombed by history.
The curse of being son of man eats hearts and souls; a mystery
made secret by your place of birth, unsure of what life means,
the young treat death as blessed demise
to trade for early paradise;
and everlasting dreams.
Love if you can for gods are strange, and do not love you back.
Why do we mortals fight their fights, in holy lands, in black Iraq,
in sunlit places, made for peace? They kill us with commands
to maim, to glorify "our" lord.
Oh how we play, on things absurd,
right into hell’s hands.
Original
A call, a cry, a father’s name; a million heads turn round.
No John, or David, Pete or Mat will bring Mohammed down.
Though saints infest the west the east protects its sneaking thief;
steals thinking sons from thoughtful life,
named in good faith to limit strife...
all synonyms for grief.
A century, millennium; time all but bombed by history.
The curse of being son of man eats hearts and souls; a mystery
made secret by your place of birth, unsure of what life means,
the young treat death as blessed demise
to trade for early paradise;
and everlasting dreams.
Love if you can, for gods are strange, and will not love you back.
Why else mortals fight their fights, in holy lands, in black Iraq,
in sunlit places, made for peace? They kill us with commands
to maim, to glorify the lord.
Oh, how we play on things absurd
right into hell’s hands.
Posts: 22
Threads: 2
Joined: Dec 2014
No John, or David, Pete or Mat will bring Mohammed down.
A call, a cry, a father’s name; a million heads turn round.
Though saints infest the west the east protects its sneaking thief;
steals thinking sons from thoughtful life,
named in good faith to limit strife...
all synonyms for grief.
I don't get the "named in good faith to limit strife..." part. Lines 1, 2, 3, 4 and 6 doesn't indicates anything that are in conjunction to limiting strife, in fact - they encourages the conflict despite it being a futile one (line 3 mark a black and white nature of the situation, from the perspective of the narrator). Needless to say, line 5 feels at odd with the rest of the stanza.
A century, millennium; time all but bombed by history.
The curse of being son of man eats hearts and souls; a mystery
made secret by your place of birth, unsure of what life means,
the young treat death as blessed demise
to trade for early paradise;
and everlasting dreams.
The term "son of man" is out of place to be used in a culture that refer themselves as slaves of God. Furthermore, only one person in New Testament history that used the term "son of man" and the term is understood as reference to His Godly nature (though some dispute this as to the contrary a human nature), still the whole context of this stanza is not about Christian civilization but an Islamic one - the apathy and move towards fundamentalism due to oppression and poverty - is what I understood from this stanza.
Love if you can for gods are strange, and do not love you back.
Why do we mortals fight their fights, in holy lands, in black Iraq,
in sunlit places, made for peace? They kill us with commands
to maim, to glorify "our" lord.
Oh how we play, on things absurd,
right into hell’s hands.
What a strange conclusion, it seems neutral and blamed both gods even though in the first stanza it was stated:
Though saints infest the west the east protects its sneaking thief;
I sense an inconsistency in the narrator view of the conflict.
Posts: 2,602
Threads: 303
Joined: Feb 2017
(12-23-2014, 07:13 PM)none Wrote: No John, or David, Pete or Mat will bring Mohammed down.
A call, a cry, a father’s name; a million heads turn round.
Though saints infest the west the east protects its sneaking thief;
steals thinking sons from thoughtful life,
named in good faith to limit strife...
all synonyms for grief.
I don't get the "named in good faith to limit strife..." part. Lines 1, 2, 3, 4 and 6 doesn't indicates anything that are in conjunction to limiting strife, in fact - they encourages the conflict despite it being a futile one (line 3 mark a black and white nature of the situation, from the perspective of the narrator). Needless to say, line 5 feels at odd with the rest of the stanza.
A century, millennium; time all but bombed by history.
The curse of being son of man eats hearts and souls; a mystery
made secret by your place of birth, unsure of what life means,
the young treat death as blessed demise
to trade for early paradise;
and everlasting dreams.
The term "son of man" is out of place to be used in a culture that refer themselves as slaves of God. Furthermore, only one person in New Testament history that used the term "son of man" and the term is understood as reference to His Godly nature (though some dispute this as to the contrary a human nature), still the whole context of this stanza is not about Christian civilization but an Islamic one - the apathy and move towards fundamentalism due to oppression and poverty - is what I understood from this stanza.
Love if you can for gods are strange, and do not love you back.
Why do we mortals fight their fights, in holy lands, in black Iraq,
in sunlit places, made for peace? They kill us with commands
to maim, to glorify "our" lord.
Oh how we play, on things absurd,
right into hell’s hands.
What a strange conclusion, it seems neutral and blamed both gods even though in the first stanza it was stated:
Though saints infest the west the east protects its sneaking thief;
I sense an inconsistency in the narrator view of the conflict. Many thanks for this.If I can begin at your end, you make the salient point. It is, both in subject and in reality, a circumstance riddled with inconsistencies. I make no apology for adding to the mess.
I have to leave god, bibles, quotes from same, entirely out of my methodology. I am really just not interested in religion as a serious pursuit or as a subjective reason to exist...or subsist.
Working backwards, then, to the sons of man reference. I make the differential purely as an observation in common usage. Again, I have no qualifications to permit me to distinguish between a son of man, (the common man, de facto) and any relative of any god, being son or cousin twice removed. Accordingly, I make no apologies for my stance....I have no stance.
Naming your children after your chosen deity...to limit strife.
Try sending you son to school in Iraq after naming him Jesus and see if he can avoid strife.
This, I admit, is a silly poetic rhyme-reach. It needs changing in word if not in worth.
Finally, and to square the circle, I hoped that this piece was about religion. Not christianity, not islam, not buddism ( hmm. difficult to define, this religion thing) but just "religion". Metaphors are important in poetry, so to get to the meat of what religion permits (note, permits...not causes) I allowed myself the luxury of Tolkien. Two worlds. East and West...metaphorically speaking, of course.
I long ago stopped involving myself in any conversations on the three G's....gods, ghosts and gravity. I see no reason to change.
Very best, and merry christmas( whatever that is)
tectak
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