On Indeterminacy

[Erthona]

On Indeterminacy
I held a jar of beans in my hand
trying to determine which bean
was the truest representative of beanieness.
 
Was there one bean that was more
bean-like than the others?
Through careful analysis
I thought I could determine it.
 
Eventually,
I gave up on this course of investigation,
and tried another.
 
To the beans I added water, spices,
and then I cooked the beans. 
Finally  I ate the beans (with relish, I might add).
Finding this course of investigation, more to my taste!
 
–Erthona
 
 
©1997
Note Bene:
The theory of "Indeterminacy" especially as it applies to poetry works thusly. Purchase one box of laxative, take all of it. Find a nice level plot of ground, take off your pants and squat down. Expel your lower digestive tract. Have a colleague note any forms or shapes they can ascertain from your art. Make a list of these shapes and forms that seem to have a connection with others. Look at this...art as a whole, notice that several images, or motifs that mostly fit, but none  contain everything one has noted. Thus you have reached the conclusion of your analyses. Notice that this is different from ambiguity, how? Well no one seems to know that. But just take our word for it, it is not. For further un-clarity, turn to Post-modern structuralism. The main thing to remember is (as we have shown) the writer cannot impose intention upon the art, and the meaning only arises with the interaction between reader and the piece (regardless of the medium). There may be many interpretations (as there will be many persons who will interact with the piece) they are all equally valid, as the art arises out of this interaction. It should be noted that there are no absolutes in art, a toddler's finger painting is just as valid as van gogh's "starry night", as both are equally a part of the human experience. 
Indeterminately yours,
Dale 

[just mercedes]

So - you're not a Pythagorean?

[Truerenigma]

It should be noted that there are no absolutes in art, a toddler's finger painting is just as valid as van gogh's "starry night", as both are equally a part of the human experience.  

The rhetoric is misleading and doesn't even get off the ground as validity and quality are not the same thing.

It's fun enough though, I suppose. 

I guess the poem could be fun too, if you like beans.



 

[milo]

Never cared much for relish, myself. Prefer sauerkraut or chili on my dogs.

[Erthona]

"So - you're not a Pythagorean? "


No, that was before my time. I did hook up with Cicero and he introduced me to these guys who called themselves Neo-Pythagoreanism. So for a while I joined them, but I became disillusioned. The Neo-Pythagoreanism were joining the Neoplatonics and increasingly incorporating the metaphysical aspects of the Neoplatonic into the Neo-Pythagoreanism, and the whole thing become more religious, and I had already had my fill of that from the Sophist.
Dale

[just mercedes]

Did you realize that you're eating the souls of dead people when you eat beans? Or, is that why you eat them? (Cue that Goya picture of Cronus devouring his son)

[Erthona]

TE wrote: "The rhetoric is misleading and doesn't even get off the ground as validity and quality are not the same thing."

Well thank god for that, as this is a synthetic a priori syllogism and as such it is suppose to tunnel under the ground.
________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Milo wrote "Never cared much for relish, myself. Prefer sauerkraut or chili on my dogs. "

Well, it's a good thing we are talking beans. Although I like sauerkraut with sausage. but not hot dogs.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________
Mercedes wrote: "Did you realize that you're eating the souls of dead people when you eat beans? Or, is that why you eat them? (Cue that Goya picture of Cronus devouring his son) "

It's like soylent green without the processing plant, souls are always cheap. If I eat more than one soul at a time it causes me heartburn, as they start arguing with each other. It's no great feat to eat your children, guppies do it all of the time.

Dale

[milo]

TE wrote: "The rhetoric is misleading and doesn't even get off the ground as validity and quality are not the same thing."

Well thank god for that, as this is a synthetic a priori syllogism and as such it is suppose to tunnel under the ground.  
________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Milo wrote "Never cared much for relish, myself. Prefer sauerkraut or chili on my dogs. "

Well, it's a good thing we are talking beans. Although I like  sauerkraut with sausage. but not hot dogs.  
_____________________________________________________________________________________________
Mercedes wrote: "Did you realize that you're eating the souls of dead people when you eat beans? Or, is that why you eat them? (Cue that Goya picture of Cronus devouring his son) "

It's like soylent green without the processing plant, souls are always cheap. If I eat more than one soul at a time it causes me heartburn, as they start arguing with each other. It's no great feat to eat your children, guppies do it all of the time.

Dale

Beans or not, I still don't like relish. Actually, its probably worse with beans.

[ellajam]

Just in case beans really means fish, relish makes a good tartar sauce.

[milo]

Tartar sauce is disgusting. There is a reason it is named after the Greek word for hell.

[ellajam]

My tartar sauce is delicious, but you've blown your chance for a sandwich.

[milo]

My tartar sauce is delicious, but you've blown your chance for a sandwich.

I don't want your sandwich from Tartarus!

[ellajam]

My tartar sauce is delicious, but you've blown your chance for a sandwich.

I don't want your sandwich from Tartarus!

Scared of a little hellraising?

[milo]

My tartar sauce is delicious, but you've blown your chance for a sandwich.

I don't want your sandwich from Tartarus!

Scared of a little hellraising?

If by hell-raising you mean a sandwich with disgusting tartar sauce on it then the answer is a resounding "yes".

[Erthona]

Milo wrote: "Have a question? Ask leanne. She is our resident guru!"

I did ask leanne. She called me an asshole and told me to fuck-off. I think next time I'll ask ellajam, she'll also tell me to fuck off , but she will do it in a nice way. Plus I also like hellcreame, I won't eat fish without it.I'm not big on fish except maybe trout, with cornbread and milk. My dad used to use buttermilk, but he doesn't anymore because he's dead, because in heaven it all turns to sweat milk. So if you are a big buttermilk fan, you'd better go to hell because that is the only place they have it, at least in the afterlife...what were we talking about?

dale

[Truerenigma]

from this living hand

[Truerenigma]

Educational fair use:

This Living Hand

This living hand, now warm and capable
Of earnest grasping, would, if it were cold
And in the icy silence of the tomb,
So haunt thy days and chill thy dreaming nights
That thou wouldst wish thine own heart dry of blood
So in my veins red life might stream again,
And thou be conscience-calmed—see here it is—
I hold it towards you.


This Living Hand [excerpt]
Dean Young, 1955
It's not only the word roses
lurking inside neurosis or the fact
that most of my formal education
occurred in the midwest, so too
my summer job inhaling industrial
reactants should be considered.
It's an unstable world, babe.
Always an inner avalanche
as they say in receiving.
I'm sure if I'd gotten a shot
of Karl instead of Zeppo Marx
in utero, things would have turned out
differently. Instead, my mother
went right on eating lobster.
But where were we? . . .

[Erthona]

" Instead, my mother
went right on eating lobster."

Did she eat them with tartar sauce?

dale

[Truerenigma]

" Instead, my mother
went right on eating lobster."

Did she eat them with  tartar sauce?

dale

lol. How would I know?  Actually he wentto Indiana and I have no idea if the question is valid or not. I've never known his mother to eat shellfish.  But the funny thing is it reminds me of someone close to me,  who is always asking me question like,  "What do the characters in Walking Dead dream about?" and "Does the guy in this poem have any pets?" and "What kind of car does he drive?"

[milo]

Why didn't the lobster share the tartar sauce?

.

.

. Because it was shellfish.