Poll: Have you ever done a found poem?
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No. That's stupid. Don't be stupid.
18.18%
2 18.18%
Nope, and don't think I will. It's not interesting and/or I'm lazy.
9.09%
1 9.09%
I haven't. I might. Perhaps. Maybe.
9.09%
1 9.09%
Yeah, I did it. But, it was a phase -- a college thing.
36.36%
4 36.36%
Oh, you know I'm all about that shit! For realz.
27.27%
3 27.27%
Total 11 vote(s) 100%
* You voted for this item. [Show Results]

What are the rules for found poems?
#1
Can you switch out little words like 'and, 'the'? Or does it have to be an exact quote? Can you mix in thoughts and images of your own, a half-and-half approach?

My immediate problem is that I have a person selected who has intriguing views and philosophies, but doesn't use much imagery/simile/metaphor in her speech. She's doing interviews and such, so she's factual -- answering questions and the like. So.....I've reached an impasse.

How do YOU approach found poems?

What's the proper way to cite the quote-ee?
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#2
You set your own parameters, but if you add words that aren't in the original text, it's no longer a 'found' poem, it's a hybrid. Then you'd add 'after blah blah'.

For myself, I made a rule to use words in the order that they appear in the text. Not everyone does that.

Why not try a poem, using her as the narrator, and incorporating her ideas?
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#3
From Wikipedia, "Found poetry" (emphasis added)

Found poetry is a type of poetry
created by taking words, phrases, and sometimes
whole passages from other sources
and reframing them as poetry
(a literary equivalent of a collage)
by making changes in spacing and lines, or
by adding or deleting text, thus imparting
new meaning.

The resulting poem can be defined as either
  treated: changed in a profound and systematic manner; or
untreated: virtually unchanged from the order, syntax
and meaning of the original.


Not that any Wiki is dispositive, but it seems a question of whether your product is "treated" or "untreated."  Source (for example "The Unknown" which is an extended quotation from Donald Rumsfeld) mentioned external to the poem seems to be sufficient.

Hope that helps... never tried it, but might.
feedback award Non-practicing atheist
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#4
Anything you want them to be, there's no accepted definition and no "International Rules Committee".
Almost all ready-made poems have been subject to editing and a limited amount is commonly accepted.

Certain publications and "contests" may have their own rules, and you should take that in mind when submitting.

I prefer the term "found ready-made" or just "ready-made" (it has a nice historical ring to it).

But in all this, you have to keep in mind that it's hard to simulate truly ready-made content and a bogus
sounding poem is usually not very effective. (And the stranger-than-fiction cliché is absolutely true.)

Just the act of selection is editing (and considering Google, what you have to select from guarantees
you can pretty much say anything you can think up).

What I like to do is use about 95% ready-made content and insert 5% of my own.
This follows the rule about good lies: "Good lies wrap themselves in truth."
(It's also a useful tool to label an original poem you've written "ready-made" to increase its narrative impact.)

But mainly, just like in all writing, there's not much point in doing it if it's not fun. You're the only one who
really knows how your poem was constructed, if you feel bad about altering the content, it stops being fun.
almost terse
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#5
I looked around online and found this (seemed helpful).

Types of Found Poetry

Poets employ a variety of techniques to create found poetry. Common forms and practices include:

Erasure: Poets take an existing source (usually limited to one or a few pages) and erase the majority of the text, leaving behind select words and phrases that, when read in order, compose the poem. Examples include Tom Phillips’ A Humument, Jen Bervin’s Nets and Austin Kleon’s newspaper blackouts, just to name a few.
Free-form excerpting and remixing: Poets excerpt words and phrases from their source text(s) and rearrange them in any manner they choose
Cento: Poets unite lines from other authors’ writings into a new poem. The original lines remain intact; the main intervention comes in arrangement and form. Read more about centos.
Cut-up: Poets physically cut or tear up a text into words and phrases, then create a poem by rearranging those strips. Arrangement may be intentional or haphazard. Read more about the cut-up method of composition.


Found Poetry and Fair Use

The Found Poetry aims to adhere to section two of American University’s Center for Social Media’s “Code of Best Uses in Fair Use for Poetry,” copied in its entirety below

NEW WORKS “REMIXED” FROM OTHER MATERIAL: ALLUSION, PASTICHE, CENTOS, ERASURE, USE OF “FOUND” MATERIAL, POETRY-GENERATING SOFTWARE

DESCRIPTION: What is now called remixing is a contemporary version of allusion or pastiche and has long been an important part of poetic practice. In general, it takes existing poetry (or literary prose) as its point of reference. In some cases, however, the stuff of poetic remix may come from other sources, including (but not limited to) advertising copy and ephemeral journalism. Members of the poetry community also recognize that technology has extended the range of techniques by which language from a range of sources may be reprocessed as new creative work.

PRINCIPLE: Under fair use, a poet may make use of quotations from existing poetry, literary prose, and non-literary material, if these quotations are re-presented in poetic forms that add value through significant imaginative or intellectual transformation, whether direct or (as in the case of poetry-generating software) indirect.

LIMITATIONS:

–Mere exploitation of existing copyrighted material, including uses that are solely “decorative” or “entertaining,” should be avoided.
–Likewise, the mere application of computer technology does not, in itself, render quotation or re-use of an existing poem fair.
–If recognizable in the final product, quotations should be brief in relation to their sources, unless there is an articulable rationale for more extensive quotation.
–The poet should provide attribution in a conventionally appropriate form unless it would be truly impractical or artistically inappropriate to do so.
The secret of poetry is cruelty.--Jon Anderson
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#6
    Here's one of mine (he includes humbly) that uses actual wording taken
    from the abstract of a U.S. patent and re-formatted in my usual style.
    This one, unlike most found poetry, can be readily verified by looking it up
    by its patent number which is included in the poem. Smile
                                    < dog diaper >     (found ready-made)
                               
                                The patents for this dog diaper    
                                are basic patents    
                                because they comprise    
                                structural features    
                                not contained    
                                in prior designs    
                                which only propose pouches    
                                placed under the tail    
                                which produce friction    
                                against the anus    
                                and do not prevent    
                                the leakage of waste    
                                outside the pouch.    
                                           
                                           
                                This pouch    
                                on the other hand    
                                provides an entrance    
                                encircling    
                                the root of the tail    
                                and the anal region    
                                of the dog    
                                and a top portion    
                                formed either    
                                as a sleeve    
                                or straps    
                                which are effective    
                                in holding the pouch    
                                by overlying the tail    
                                and in association with it    
                                keep the pouch    
                                away from the anus    
                                and allow enough room    
                                to comfortably    
                                discharge the waste    
                                and to avoid    
                                leakage    
                                or friction    
                                beneath the tail.    
                                           
                                           
                                           
                                The issued patents are:    
                                U.S. Patents: 4,537,153    
                                4,779,573 5,146,874    
                                UK Patent: GB2,187,374    
                                Canada Patent: 1,254,456    
                                EPO Patent: 0231171    
                                German Patent: P 35 84 520.1-08    
                                Belgium Patent: 85903909.1    
                                Luxembourg Patent: LU-85 903 909    
                                French Patent: EPO 0231171    
                                Switzerland Patent: EPO 0231171    
                                Australia Patent: 586828    
                                           
                                  - - -



And:

(05-19-2017, 05:33 AM)Lizzie Wrote:  ...
My immediate problem is that I have a person selected who has intriguing views and philosophies, but doesn't use much imagery/simile/metaphor in her speech. She's doing interviews and such, so she's factual -- answering questions and the like. So.....I've reached an impasse.

I don't think the ready-made (found) poetry concept really works for this.
What I'd do (advice follows) is to become familiar enough with her "intriguing views and
philosophies" that you can write your own poem in your own words that says what's
important to you about these ideas and includes all the imagery/simile/metaphor that your
heart desires.

(05-19-2017, 05:33 AM)Lizzie Wrote:  What's the proper way to cite the quote-ee?

Directly under the title say: "Inspired by _Name of Person_", or  "Inspired by the writings of _Name of Person_ ",
or "ideas of", or "views of", or whatever combination you think is appropriate.
almost terse
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#7
Thanks so much for all the help and info, everybody! I'm going to keep on pressing with the one that I'm working on now with her as the narrator. But, I probably won't do that again. All of these types of found poems are intriguing though! I'm very inspired to do found poems now, copiously, like humping bunnies....
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#8
(05-19-2017, 05:33 AM)Lizzie Wrote:  Can you switch out little words like 'and, 'the'? Or does it have to be an exact quote? Can you mix in thoughts and images of your own, a half-and-half approach?

My immediate problem is that I have a person selected who has intriguing views and philosophies, but doesn't use much imagery/simile/metaphor in her speech. She's doing interviews and such, so she's factual -- answering questions and the like. So.....I've reached an impasse.

How do YOU approach found poems?

What's the proper way to cite the quote-ee?

I agree with Ray in that they should be called "read-mades" in the spirit of Duchamp and the dadaists.  THere is a full discussion of this concept somewhere on this site.

In my opinion (which isn't necessarily worth much) any changes to the original source should be noted.  My favourite technique for ready-mades is to take an existing text and change the meaning entirely by using a title that juxtaposes it.

Here are a few of mine:

http://www.pigpenpoetry.com/thread-13960.html

http://www.pigpenpoetry.com/thread-13976.html

http://www.pigpenpoetry.com/thread-13959.html
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#9
(05-19-2017, 10:21 AM)milo Wrote:  ...

Here are a few of mine:

http://www.pigpenpoetry.com/thread-13960.html

http://www.pigpenpoetry.com/thread-13976.html

http://www.pigpenpoetry.com/thread-13959.html

Excellent! I'd never read/seen these.
(The middle one that uses the advanced multiple-media technique of true auteur poets is especially significant.)
almost terse
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#10
Fabulous idea, milo. And equally fabulous threads! Thanks for sharing.
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