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i know it doesnt count as criticism, but has there ever been an option to just click you like it? or dislike? too facebookie?
For me, it would reduce my incentive to comment substantively. My two cents.

Also, I put some of my poems up for my friends to crit in a facebook group and they would just 'like' them and I wouldn't get any written feedback. It was so irritating, because it basically provided me with nothing useful that I could use to revise my work.
Way too facebookie. Likes are, as lizzie points out, shown to be a disincentive to comment. I even hate them on facebook, the kingdom of like-don't-read-just-pretend-you-love-stuff-so-people-pretend-to-love-you-too.

just mercedes

(09-12-2016, 08:32 AM)Leanne Wrote: [ -> ]Way too facebookie.  Likes are, as lizzie points out, shown to be a disincentive to comment.  I even hate them on facebook, the kingdom of like-don't-read-just-pretend-you-love-stuff-so-people-pretend-to-love-you-too.


I just had a stranger-than-usual FB happening - a fellow NZ poet blogged about the editor of an ezine (Otoliths) and how the editor had rejected his poem, and asked him to never submit to his magazine again. He also posted the poem Mark had rejected. Then he posted the whole blog to FB.

It's a racist rant, the poem, and I wouldn't have accepted it either. I didn't say so though, I commented only that I'd had a few poems in Otoliths, and Mark had always been professional and courteous in our dealings.

My comment was deleted. The comments left on the post are all supportive of the poet and his poem.

That's the danger of people 'liking' posts - actually believing the number of 'like's is an indication of the relative merits of the work.

I could have said more. I could have asked him if he'd even read Otoliths before he submitted there - Mark likes edgy, experimental work.

I don't know if this is another manifestation of  NZ's habitual passive-aggressive bullshit, but it's ugly.

Sometimes I wonder why I bother to write.
For the adoration of millions.

Oh bugger.

just mercedes

(09-12-2016, 11:34 AM)Leanne Wrote: [ -> ]For the adoration of millions.

Oh bugger.

Oh bugger. I left my run too late. Smile
do you have a link to this FB page? just curious...
For the record, I love almost everything Otoliths publishes, and even the pieces I don't love make me happy that they're being created.

just mercedes

(09-12-2016, 12:03 PM)Leanne Wrote: [ -> ]For the record, I love almost everything Otoliths publishes, and even the pieces I don't love make me happy that they're being created.

Thumbsup Thumbsup

(09-12-2016, 11:46 AM)Achebe Wrote: [ -> ]do you have a link to this FB page? just curious...

Sure - it's the group Writers Up North - Northland Writers

https://www.facebook.com/groups/449540938563494/
I don't think a poem should be barred from publishing simply because the majority of people find it offensive....

... and I think requesting that someone never submit another poem again because one poem they wrote offended you is petty.

But, most poems that enshrine themselves with hate are pretentious crap anyway... so if it was rejected on that basis.... it's fine.
Well actually, an editor has every right to select only pieces that he feels uphold the values of his publication, just like an employer has every right to enforce a code of conduct.
(09-12-2016, 12:41 PM)Pdeathstar Wrote: [ -> ]I don't think a poem should be barred from publishing simply because the majority of people find it offensive....

... and I think requesting that someone never submit another poem again because one poem they wrote offended you is petty.

But, most poems that enshrine themselves with hate are pretentious crap anyway... so if it was rejected on that basis.... it's fine.

Wait, Q said something I can wholly agree with? Whoa.
He has a right, yes. But should he, no. It's funny how tolerance is only meant for the just.
I dislike the tone of the rejection letter and am not convinced that's a very professional way of dealing with things, but then again, it's a publication he puts a lot of effort into and it's not your right as a poet to be published wherever you deign to submit your work of genius.
I agree. I wasn't specifically talking about this instance, having not read the poem...
I didn't find it racist (I didn't think that the poet was identifying himself with the narrator), but it was boring, like a lot of poems about society's ills.
I saw in another thread somewhere here the idea of critiquing criticism, and imagined a sort of rating system by mods.  Feedback can be very difficult to give, and a lot of my browsing has been just reading the feedback, unsure if anything I add would be useful in the slightest.


(09-12-2016, 08:32 AM)Leanne Wrote: [ -> ]Way too facebookie.  Likes are, as lizzie points out, shown to be a disincentive to comment.  I even hate them on facebook, the kingdom of like-don't-read-just-pretend-you-love-stuff-so-people-pretend-to-love-you-too.
(09-12-2016, 10:36 PM)CRNDLSM Wrote: [ -> ]I saw in another thread somewhere here the idea of critiquing criticism, and imagined a sort of rating system by mods.  Feedback can be very difficult to give, and a lot of my browsing has been just reading the feedback, unsure if anything I add would be useful in the slightest.


(09-12-2016, 08:32 AM)Leanne Wrote: [ -> ]Way too facebookie.  Likes are, as lizzie points out, shown to be a disincentive to comment.  I even hate them on facebook, the kingdom of like-don't-read-just-pretend-you-love-stuff-so-people-pretend-to-love-you-too.

As someone who loves editing with lots of crit I can tell you that every one is worthwhile. If three members point to the same high or low point it weighs differently than if one had liked or disliked something.

While I love reading the crit on all the threads, when I write my own I start from scratch and examine my own experience with the piece. Often as I write I see things I hadn't seen before.

Don't hesitate, jump on in, the more crit the better. Smile

As to rating critique, people are hesitant enough to post their critiques, no need to hang fear of a poor rating over our heads. This ain't school or work, it's supposed to be fun.Smile You can always use the PM system to say Great crit!
I think if I knew that people (other than the author) were going to be rating my crits, I'd shrivel into a corner. I'd never post.

Also, I truly think that the only one that can authentically evaluate the usefulness of a crit is the author themselves. Mods may think a crit is well explicated, but that doesn't mean that the author will find it useful in leading the poem where they want it to go.

Also, the mods often disagree even between each other about what changes need to be made in a poem. I don't think any objective rating system could be devised.