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what is?
trying to save endangered species
right. i guess like all the other animals
we share the planet with we just don't
give a shit. pretty soon all we'll have
as company will be insect, birds and domesticated livestock Sad
that's what it starts looking likeAngry
The money part is definitely big, but our attitude towards animals is the ultimate culprid. We view animals as expendables. It's our prejudices that allows us to deny others the rights that we expect to have for ourselves which should and must include animals. Also our arrogance, separating us from other speices, thinking that we are superior and more worthy of the right to life. In our arrogance we gave this false right to ourselves to think that we are above other species ... just because we can subdue other species doesn't mean we should.
Educating ourselves is the only way animals will have a fighting and fair chance.

altezon

Nature can be cruel too. But arrogance is bad for the spirit, and humility is good for it. Or so I've heard. [Image: smile.gif]
(09-04-2010, 03:04 PM)kath3 Wrote: [ -> ]The money part is definitely big, but our attitude towards animals is the ultimate culprid. We view animals as expendables. It's our prejudices that allows us to deny others the rights that we expect to have for ourselves which should and must include animals. Also our arrogance, separating us from other speices, thinking that we are superior and more worthy of the right to life. In our arrogance we gave this false right to ourselves to think that we are above other species ... just because we can subdue other species doesn't mean we should.
Educating ourselves is the only way animals will have a fighting and fair chance.
i have to agree that we're arrogant in regards to other animals. but for me it's the greed we're capable of that really enforces that arrogance.

their is one more way and it's a much more likely scenario; wiping ourselves out, even soylent greening ourselves. pretty soon we'll be at the tipping point of homo sapien extinction if we don't come up with some way to co exist with everything else on the planet.

altezon; yes, natures definitely cruel but it's not greedy it doesn't hoard, (apart from squirrels etc )

(09-05-2010, 07:34 AM)billy Wrote: [ -> ]
(09-04-2010, 03:04 PM)kath3 Wrote: [ -> ]The money part is definitely big, but our attitude towards animals is the ultimate culprid. We view animals as expendables. It's our prejudices that allows us to deny others the rights that we expect to have for ourselves which should and must include animals. Also our arrogance, separating us from other speices, thinking that we are superior and more worthy of the right to life. In our arrogance we gave this false right to ourselves to think that we are above other species ... just because we can subdue other species doesn't mean we should.
Educating ourselves is the only way animals will have a fighting and fair chance.

i have to agree that we're arrogant in regards to other animals. but for me it's the greed we're capable of that really enforces that arrogance.

and for me, it's our arrogance that produces and nurtures greediness. If we had true (and I can't emphasize the word enough) respect for all living creatures then money wouldn't even be a part of it.

(09-05-2010, 07:34 AM)billy Wrote: [ -> ]their is one more way and it's a much more likely scenario; wiping ourselves out, even soylent greening ourselves. pretty soon we'll be at the tipping point of homo sapien extinction if we don't come up with some way to co exist with everything else on the planet.

I feel we have become too separate "spiritually" from this planet to save ourselves. I'm not talking about God, but an indepth connection that only can be attained from a higher level of thinking and preceiving ... wholly attuned, that I myself struggle to grasp/hold onto. We have to ... must become selfless. I'm not so sure we are capable of that.
I kinda think/feel that we're hooped.Undecided



i tend to agree. i can't see us caring enough to changed the trend of making extinct, that which we need to survive. we may be the only animal to have sophisticated intelligence but it won't stop us from stupidly squandering what we have.
(09-05-2010, 02:47 PM)billy Wrote: [ -> ]i tend to agree. i can't see us caring enough to changed the trend of making extinct, that which we need to survive. we may be the only animal to have sophisticated intelligence but it won't stop us from stupidly squandering what we have.

ABSOLUTELY ... because we don't know what is precious and what is not.
so is there a just, or fair deterrent, or doesn't make a difference what ever we do?

Sadly I am fearful that it will take a brush with extinction before we get it. We have the capability right now to always do what is right. It all gets back to which wolf you choose to feed.
(09-05-2010, 03:25 PM)billy Wrote: [ -> ]so is there a just, or fair deterrent, or doesn't make a difference what ever we do?

Sorry billy, I was answering your question with our conversation and not the op.
So as for a fair and just deterrent I would say jail time (so they can ponder what they have done) with educational classes on animal welfare, and protection of endangered speices.
Along with a stiff enough fine that it will hurt.
If they provide the name of their buyer then perhaps some leniency.

i like the idea of leniency if they supply the buyers details.
though if a conviction on the buyer is gained i'd say a large jail sentance.

would it be a deterrent if the law stated that buyers would get 20 years if convicted?
ouch! 20 years ... yep, that'd probably do it. I think 3 - 5 would be sufficient. Long enough to hurt but no so long as to destroy them.

mrmod

As someone has said, she was only the middle man. And she got all the crap Confused.
when i say buyer i meant end buyer.
and are we forgetting the seller. maybe a even
a bit more leniency if they're given up as well.
how sick the world is, the poor tiger cub. That woman deserves to burn in hell. I'm glad the cub was rescued and a fine and prison time should be the punishment. (Then later she'll burn in hell, of course). Or maybe karma would have it that she goes to a zoo and accidently slips in her high heels near a Bengal Tiger exhibit and falls into their area, and gosh they were just about to be fed, but wouldn't they rather enjoy live food instead, so they go for her and the hunt and she screams, but she can't escape, breaks her other heel and she's torn to shreds and gobbled up while people witness the horror. Smile yeah!
i think you're of the same mind as addy Wink
(09-06-2010, 09:47 AM)Bianca Alabaster Wrote: [ -> ]how sick the world is, the poor tiger cub. That woman deserves to burn in hell. I'm glad the cub was rescued and a fine and prison time should be the punishment. (Then later she'll burn in hell, of course). Or maybe karma would have it that she goes to a zoo and accidently slips in her high heels near a Bengal Tiger exhibit and falls into their area, and gosh they were just about to be fed, but wouldn't they rather enjoy live food instead, so they go for her and the hunt and she screams, but she can't escape, breaks her other heel and she's torn to shreds and gobbled up while people witness the horror. Smile yeah!

WoW! What an active imagination. Big Grin
I love the karma one! Tongue

mrmod

The woman should have her prison time quartered if she gave details of the sellers and buyers. Now that would be useful.
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